Wednesday, August 1, 2012

The Whosoevers: A "Christian" Band and Their Interesting Graphics

Warning this article includes Satanic imagery and symbols. I am putting this out to EXPOSE these things, though I have to admit, this stuff is so dark, even choosing to do this article was tough. But someone has to say something about these so called "Christian" rock bands who are out there deceiving young people using the symbols, and attitudes borrowed from Satanic influenced "heavy metal" and other music genres. When I became a Christian, I had to repent of listening to years worth of the world's most wicked music. This was during my youth, but my own ears were filled with heavy metal, goth, industrial and everything else Satan had to offer. I am quite familiar how in that world they think everything DARK is "COOL". I hate seeing young people led into false Christianity and even influenced to embrace the world via bands like this. Even more sickening is they are invited to play right in the churches. 

“It is better to hear the rebuke of the wise, than for a man to hear the song of fools.” —Ecclesiastes 7:5

This is so in the face, one can tell they aren't even trying to "hide" it anymore from those can "see".
I considered doing an article long ago on the apostate Christian rock bands and how they have marked themselves.  One can see the single eye Horus markings, such as in Toby Mac's latest album with his single huge eyeball right on the front of a bright green cover talked about here, and the parade of skulls and other questionable graphics. I am glad others have exposed these artists, but then I found a group that is so marked with occult and other questionable symbols, I thought well I will go ahead and post on this. Some of you may even find it hard to believe how extreme this all is.

The Whosoevers are a so called "Christian" band growing more in popularity. At this link notice the skull and the number "23" on the lower right. On an older article on this blog, we have been having a discussion about these markings. [scroll down to the latter comments]

What Symbols Can Tell You #1 The Eye of Horus

During the course of this conversation I found their blog. 

Tell me what you think seeing the X, the obivous OWL, the saturn spirals in the wings, and the "V" of the forehead and smaller "V" below.......Count the occult symbols. Jesus is already risen, Who are they calling on to ARISE? And what is the meaning of the number 37?

By the way it gets worse, much worse. Think about how Satan wants to influence the young people out there and then ask yourself, why would a so called Christian band want to cloak itself so much in the symbols of the occult and darkness?

Ok if they see the HORUS eyes and other satanic symbols as being part of the "organized religion" world, why is it on THEIR ART WORK TOO? Why do they have the "revolution fist" think Che Guevara with their band logo on it, a logo which by the way is an ENCIRCLED W?

Seeing that organized religion graphic, the band members have worn that too on T-Shirts. 

Yes the first letter of the band's name but if you know about the connotations of how "W" is used out there, a very questionable one. Remembering the Vs used on the Owl and the design, W can be used as an occult marker as well

The letter “W” in the mystical practices of Kabalism is emblematic of the “Dark Side” of magick.

Why do their band members wear the art of one Shepard Fairey with it's mind control meme of OBEY, Pentagrams and worse? By the way Shepard Fairey did the iconic Obama-HOPE poster that we saw all over the place during the 2008 election.

How many hand signs in this picture? The eyes with acouple are very scary or being made to look scary.

What's with this guy, and that SS [Nazi] Skull T-Shirt? So they slap a Christian saying on an other wise Satanic T-Shirt and call it a day? Doesn't this guy know what the SS-lightening symbols meant to the Nazis and it had to do with death and destruction?

This band and other affiliated groups like POD, have been invited to play at Calvary Chapel churches.

Here is a poster promoting one of their shows at a Calvary Chapel [the blue arrow is from me pointing out the band name, the W with the circle around it is their logo. The Term "murder your flesh" is creepy enough, skewing what the Bible says.

Isn't Ryan Ries  a son of a Calvary Chapel pastor?

This is supposed to be an ad, for a "Christian" rock concert. You're kidding me right? [blue arrows added by me to point out names]

Here is one of their videos, watch with the sound off, but you can see the symbols on the shirts and more. Why does one wear a sweat shirt, with Catholic iconography of a "pierced heart"?

One of The Whosoever's members is Brian Welch, also known as Head, who used to be a member of the secular heavy metal band Korn. He came out as having became a Christian and got involved in the Whosoever "ministry" according to Wikipedia.:

"The Whosoevers
In 2008, Sonny Sandoval, of P.O.D., and Ryan Ries, son of Pastor Raul Ries of Calvary Chapel Golden Springs, Lacey Sturm of Flyleaf created a ministry with Welch and freestyle motocross aerialist Ronnie Faisst. Taking the name "The Whosoevers" (from John 3:16), the ministry "seek[s] to impact those whose pain has previously driven them to addictive or self-destructive behaviors."[34]"

By the way, the lyrics are scary too, I checked a few out, I may post a few in comments, but for now will spare my readers.

Anyone as disturbed by the use of these symbols as I am? My advice for any Christian family keep the young people away from any modern "Christian" music, unless you have checked it out for yourself and even then be careful.


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Kayfabe said...

Hello Bible Believer,

A few years ago I went to a Greg Laurie crusade and saw POD among other bands. I went with the Calvary Chapel Montebello youth group as a youth leader. After the crusade we went to eat at "In & Out" and I mentioned to the youth pastor that none of these groups really sang about Jesus especially POD. A few others noticed the same thing. Then a couple years ago a group called "The Whosoevers" came to CCM and spoke and we had the youth sit in the main sanctuary. My discernment was not really high at the time due to other things but I remember that much of the focus by the speaker Ryan Ries, who is the son of the well known Calvary Pastor Raul Ries, was on his testimony and not on Jesus. His testimony was one of drugs, sex, rock and roll (promoting heavy metal concerts) and he went into details. What about 1 Corinthians 2:2-"For I determined not to know anything among you except Jesus Christ and Him crucified.”

Ryan went on and on about his testimony and I understand that our testimonies can be used to minister to others but we have to be careful in how we present it. There is no need to go into graphic detail and almost glorify it. Also those things should be said with shame. It is the testimony of Jesus that saves not ours. Ryan repeated this on a radio show here in L.A. The Frank Pastore show. It's alot of his testimony but not much in the way of the Word of God. "The Whosoevers" are nothing but the latest Christian trendy fad masquering as some rebel type Christian group when in reality they are very much in lock step with the "SYSTEM". They have been to CCM anumber of times and they are extremely popular there.

Anonymous said...

"Los Angeles-based, Ryan Ries, is a crazy man, a visionary, and a prodigal. He’s a hero to kids around the world who are misunderstood, left for dead, and cynical about religion. As co-founder of The Whosoevers, Ries has been invited to tell his story and the vision of The Whosoever movement. Ries spent nineteen years widely known for his work in the skateboard, snowboard, and music industries. He managed one of the top skateboard teams and his marketing insights helped build C1RCA Footwear. On the music side, he headed up Art Direction for Base 9 Film & Music. Additionally, he worked with Special Blend Outerwear, Forum Snowboards, Foursquare Outerwear, and Jeenyus Snowboards. He is known for pioneering the event, Skate Jam, a large festival style contest that brought the skate and music cultures together. Ries traveled the world, hung out with celebrities, and dove head first into everything the world had to offer—money, women, drugs. However, after many years of partying, overdosing, and seeing his friends die, he was “over it.” He knew he had to make some serious changes or end up dead. However, he was at a point where he was drinking every day and often mixing that with drugs. “I had to drink just to turn my brain off. As a last resort, in a hotel room in Panama, Ries decided to reach out to God. “Okay God, if you’re real, prove it. I don’t want to live like this anymore. I’ve been doing this for 19 years and I’m over it. How many drugs can I do, how much alcohol can I drink, how many girls can I sleep with, and still feel like something’s missing?” After praying in that hotel room, and turning his life over to Christ, Ries stole a Gideon’s Bible from the hotel room and read it on the flight home. The rest was, as he likes to say, “a done deal.” He stopped the drugs, the drinking, the lifestyle, and everything that was destroying his future. His friends and co-workers immediately saw a change and He emerged with a new vision for his life, a new direction to channel his drive and passion. However, he didn’t want to leave behind his friends or the skate-art-music culture he had so much love for. After taking a year off to skate, surf, and reflect on his future, Ries, along with friend and rock star, Sonny of P.O.D., had a vision to launch The Whosoever’s in 2008 – a worldwide movementfor kids who’ve been left behind. According to Ries, “We’re not trying to tap into the culture, We ARE the culture.” Along with numerous speaking engagements, Ries is right back where he belongs overseeing all aspects of The Whosoever’s, including their much sought after apparel line. In addition, he and his team are producing the 2nd Annual Whosoever Session in Los Angeles titled, Threat to Formalized Religion… I AM. The two-day FREE event includes many the hottest bands and speakers around, including Head (Korn), Fieldy (Korn), Bethany Hamilton (Soul Surfer), Lance Mountain (Pro Skater), Icon For Hire, Dominic Balli, and many more.
”that was from their website.

Anonymous said...

There are plenty of issues with this. I'll leave it as is so the readers can use their own discernment. The pictures you posted aren't nearly as bad as what's really on their website. Taking, "I AM," from Jehovah God, our Abba, and putting it on their forehead doesn't make them any less blasphemous as Shirley MacLaine claiming to be god herself. sick. If they're Christian music, then why bother not listening to secular demonic music, really?

Anonymous said...

I guess they'll argue that this stuff brings in more of the youth, and the old folks just "don't get it".

We'll I still consider myself part of the youth, and to me, this stuff is a boring snoozefest.

Give me beautiful music that exalts Jesus any day over this stuff.

Anonymous said...


After Head's interview with Pat Robertson, I immediately looked into it hoping for the best. What I saw wasn't good. I even wrote an email to Brian "Head". Yea, that got read. :( (POD has the markings all over). At first I thought Head got himself caught with the wrong people again and I pitied him.

I really can't tell if they are deceived, or deceivers. But I do know they seem up on things with all the symbols, so they must know what they're doing, right?

When do we stop being so tolerant and inclusive? Is this helping our youth? NO

I think we need to show something different to today's youth, something courageous which they will need to be believers and followers of Jesus Christ. I don't think we need to bring worldy things to them and expect that to change their lives.

Marion said...

Bringing more of the youth the death cults.

Kayfabe said...

"Threat to Formalized Religion"

That makes me laugh as they are very much a part of formalized religion otherwise you probably wouldn't even hear of them.

Anonymous said...

Excellent article. Thanks for doing this. I pray it will help open people's eyes. Very well written.

First anon said it highlighted: Ryan didn't want to leave his friends and culture behind.

When Jesus Christ is really leading us, that's what ends up happening, though. That old life is not appealing anymore.

shilosontheleft said...

"Leviticus 10, 1 And Nadab and Abihu, the sons of Aaron, took either of them his censer, and put fire therein, and put incense thereon, and offered strange fire before the LORD, which he commanded them not. 2 And there went out fire from the LORD, and devoured them, and they died before the LORD. 3 Then Moses said unto Aaron, This is it that the LORD spake , saying , I will be sanctified in them that come nigh me, and before all the people I will be glorified . And Aaron held his peace"

These bands are offering STRANGE FIRE.
Since Ryan Reis is a CC pastor's son and since CC follows the MOSES (BERG) MODEL, and since Raul Reis is one of Chuck Moses Smith's priests, I thought the above would be especially appropriate.
I don't think God CARES how many folks, YOUNG OR OLD, are attracted to Strange Fire.
In case you missed it.... GOD KILLED the SONS OF AARON.... burned 'em alive He did in dramatic fashion in front of all the people!
And what did Aaron do?
He kept his mouth shut.
Aaron was not even allowed to openly grieve..... I think we can assume God was serious about this.
Does anyone think that God is no longer serious about STRANGE FIRE?

But WHY would God be so INTOLERANT" of a few "radical" logos, clothes, and songs?
Correct me if I am wrong, but I've heard that the term BAAL (Lord) was sometimes used in reference to Yaweh.
That gets things confused doesn't it?
This word was used as a title not as a proper noun, but it still gives one pause doesn't it?
And, it allows the Atheists a place to claim Canaan Baal (Lord) was one and same as the Baal (Lord) of the Israelites.
Well then think about if the Children of Israel had started using Mystery Religion methodologies in the wilderness, before they'd even gotten to Canaan, how confusing would that be?
Judasim is based on Genesis, Exodus, Deuteronomy, Numbers, and Leviticus... there would be no Judaism if these had been corrupted... and there would be no Christianity!

So perhaps Ryan Reis and company's strange fire abominations are not as critical as the SON'S OF AARRON'S abominations.... but they are confusing what is of God and what is not of God.

Think of how just 27 years ago Dave Hunt Wrote THE SEDUCTION OF CHRISTIANITY warning Christians of New Age (=Wiccan/Satanism/Paganism/Hinduism) infiltration in the church yet we now have AT LEAST 80% of Protestant pastors TOTALLY BOUGHT IN to the SEDUCTION.
These are SEMINARY TRAINED pastors by the way.

There has been an awful lot of Christian
Abominations puked up on the beaches of California.
Don't be surprised if California ACTUALLY DOES DROP OFF INTO THE SEA! LOL!!

Anonymous said...

AMEN Shilo!! There is nothing about this that does not reek of satanic infiltration of the churches...nothing. It's written all over them, literally. Duh. How much more in your face an they make it. There is no true man of God pastor that would tolerate this, I don't care what public cover-up excuses they or anyone else make for it. It is horrific and shocking that this group or any other like it would be considered representative of anything Christian and allowed in Christian churches. Unbelievable.

What you said about California, Shilo, sure hit the nail on the head.

Anonymous said...

Whether they are knowing deceivers or not makes no diffrence, they should NEVER be allowed in the hurches. And as blatant as this is, it's impossible for me to give them any benefit of the doubt. This is a very grievous day for the church, thanks to all of its satanic silver tongued, hireling, and compromised wimp leadership.

Anonymous said...

Combining a so-called testimony with proud, blatant representation of God's enemy and his fallen world is an oxymoron. It is hupocrisy. And it would cause confusion in new believers. And erect a barrier to the HOLY Spirit led life of holiness/separation unto God from the the things of the world, which God expects of us and gives us the means for by His Spirit and Word. It is in fact a blatant rejection of the power and will of God.

Anonymous said...

Symbol Alert:

The young man in the Out Of The Shadows poster was drawn in a Masonic pose. See hand position.

Aka Alert

shilo'sontheleft said...

Correct me if I am wrong but do we know for sure just how aware of the seriousness of their sin the Sons of Aaron were?
If we give them the benefit of the doubt and decide they were not that aware wouldn't God have needed to do what He did regardless?
Do you think these pastors have ANY understanding of this?

This points to an observation I've made recently.
Back before the Cultural Revolution of the 60s, folks in America were not all Godly, but they were all God Fearin'..... with very very few exceptions.
I'm talking about the Christians and NON Christians.....even the thugs and outlaws Anon.
Today the Christians are not only not Godly they are not even God Fearin'.... ESPECIALLY THE PASTORS!!!
I've been blogging about Calvary Chapel a lot this last year and talk about no fear of God.... that bunch are the GOLD STANDARD for 21st Century NON GOD FEARIN' PREACHERS TYPES.
Note.... I could have written STANDARD.... but I wrote GOLD STANDARD.

Anonymous said...

It's obviously so dark and brooding and depressing. Where's the cross of Jesus Christ in all this? Where is the joy of the Lord in it?

If I were an unbeliever, and this is what I saw, I'd think it was some kind of a death cult.

Anonymous said...

Brian Head Welch with a Whosoevers T-shirt. The all-seeing eye is at the bottom:

Bible Believer said...

HI Kayfabe,

I am glad you told that CC youth pastor that none of those bands sung about Jesus Christ. It is sad how many churches are letting this false music in. It is all over the place from Franklin Graham "crusades" to Greg Laurie "Harvests". I've noticed the drug-laden tales of the CC crowd during the testimonies. The creepiest ones of course are one's like Lonnie's who claim he met God under a haze of LSD. But you all notice these guys seem to glorify a certain lifestyle. None of them say "Oh yeah I was a book reading atheist nerd, who collected stamps in my spare time", but they all get up there and talk about themselves as these intense "rock n roll" rebels. When I talk about my past, deceived in the UU, I am sad about the years wasted and repentant. These guys almost seem to GLORIFY themselves, hey look at me, "I AM COOL! I was a REBEL!"

I noticed this even on one false website that said it was witnessing to witches and occultists and that they were ex-occultists. I was a newer Christian and that is probably one of the FIRST phony websites I discerned. They were giving way too many details, almost liked they missed what they were in. It bugged me. I told them and they banned me.
Amen on Cor 2:2

You are right those things should be said with shame. It should not be self glorying or focusing on the self but on JESUS CHRIST.

Yeah definitely the WHOSOEVERS are part of the SYSTEM and have marked themselves as being so.

Bible Believer said...

From the article...

"Los Angeles-based, Ryan Ries, is a crazy man, a visionary, and a prodigal."

Yeah notice the focus on him....he is one "crazy"'s more the manufactured rebellion is cool kids stuff.

"He’s a hero to kids around the world who are misunderstood, left for dead, and cynical about religion."

They want to take advantage of the kids, who are non-discerning and know very little and who have been abused or are in other serious problems. This troubles me.

" He managed one of the top skateboard teams and his marketing insights helped build C1RCA Footwear. On the music side, he headed up Art Direction for Base 9 Film & Music. Additionally, he worked with Special Blend Outerwear, Forum Snowboards, Foursquare Outerwear, and Jeenyus Snowboards."

You ever notice all these guys always have huge connections. You never see some preacher come out who lost his job at the factory and who previously lived on minimum wage. It's something I've noticed, just how connected all the CC pastors ARE.

"He is known for pioneering the event, Skate Jam, a large festival style contest that brought the skate and music cultures together. Ries traveled the world, hung out with celebrities, and dove head first into everything the world had to offer—money, women, drugs."

Extreme wealth.

Remember this is the pastor's son, not the Korn rock star.

So how'd he have the money and connections to do all that stuff? Not every want a be skateboarder becomes a multi-business, world traveler. Something to think about.

"However, after many years of partying, overdosing, and seeing his friends die, he was “over it.” He knew he had to make some serious changes or end up dead. However, he was at a point where he was drinking every day and often mixing that with drugs. “I had to drink just to turn my brain off."

More of the endless sordid details about "partying" to add to the persona of perceived "coolness".

"As a last resort, in a hotel room in Panama, Ries decided to reach out to God. “Okay God, if you’re real, prove it. I don’t want to live like this anymore. I’ve been doing this for 19 years and I’m over it. How many drugs can I do, how much alcohol can I drink, how many girls can I sleep with, and still feel like something’s missing?” After praying in that hotel room, and turning his life over to Christ, Ries stole a Gideon’s Bible from the hotel room and read it on the flight home."

Why did they share the detail about him STEALING the Bible?

Where is the embarrasment and shame for ripping off a Bible?

Even there his "conversion" seems rooted in self. Like he is more worried about being tired and burnt out then desiring for true repentance.
"His friends and co-workers immediately saw a change and He emerged with a new vision for his life, a new direction to channel his drive and passion. However, he didn’t want to leave behind his friends or the skate-art-music culture he had so much love for. "

And right here is the clincher,

he didn't want to leave behind the culture, etc. One thing too when one really becomes a Christian, some friends will LEAVE YOU. You do not fit in certain circles, ever again.
"According to Ries, “We’re not trying to tap into the culture, We ARE the culture.”

Emergent RECULTURATION stuff.

"Along with numerous speaking engagements, Ries is right back where he belongs overseeing all aspects of The Whosoever’s, including their much sought after apparel line."

Ever notice how much big money goes along with this stuff?

Bible Believer said...

Yeah I noticed the "I Am" stickers and titles, total blasphemy. TOTAL. There were things I did not remark on, sometimes I get so disgusted and want to spare readers all the gritty details. It is a cornucopia of every satanic rock/mind control/secret society/occult meme one can think of.

Yeah I asked myself too, what is the difference between their music and the satanic stuff on the regular airwaves? The lyrics are bad too just so you all know. Very bad. WARNING THIS IS BLASPHEMOUS, and posting for expose' purposes.

Bible Believer said...

I agree these bands are selling strange fire. Thinking about the lyrics above, especially the last 4, they are selling even false Catholicism with that one, such as in the Catholic Eucharist and wine.

All the roots are rotten with this place. I remember when I started suspecting a network among in the CC world and well we are seeing it. [Sure it exists in OTHER church denominations too]

This guy is just a pastor's son and he is in it deep.

The world with it's wicked music celebrates everything of Satan. I am surrounded by those who still love the rock n roll world, and for MANY it has served as something to keep them AWAY FROM THE LORD.

I do not think they are "worshipping" God via this stuff but another spirit and ARE WORSHIPING BAAL...[not BAAL used as name to dignify deity, but BAAL himself--Satan]

Notice too, on all the websites, references to "Christ" and nothing to Jesus Christ.
One thing, be careful of Dave Hunt, GOOD BOOK BY THE WAY I LEARNED MUCH FROM, but Dave Hunt had way too many connections to Missler and Rapture Ready and other false ministries for me to feel comfortable with him. Though in his case due to his age and more, I do not know what he knew or did not know, but it was troubling to me as Dave Hunt even wrote another good book, that warned of Rome. Of course I do not agree with Hunt's eschatological and other views.

So yes there are SEMINARY TRAINED pastors opening the door to these bands.

California was a home to a lot of what was Satanic. The whole 60s movement was birthed in California. Some believe a PLANNED direction to lead to the moral down-fall of America. The celebrities and HOLLY-wood, and rest all have been used by Satan to influence America and the world. Why wouldn't the Jesus Movement come out of the same place? They not only wanted to infiltrate the arts, morality, academia, etc, but the churches as well. There is a lot of creepiness that slithered out of Laurel Canyon and beyond.

I wouldn't be surprised if that place dropped into the sea either.

Bible Believer said...

Anonymous said...

Anon, when you say this is a grievous day for the church, you are right. Today they aren't even trying to hide what they are anymore. I think they love to mock, and show all the symbols and more they can, knowing most do not "see" and the ones who do "see" are going to get away from them as far as possible except in cases where they expose them.

For those seeing the masonic symbols they are all over. In one picture even the way they were standing, was ON THE SQUARE, if you get what I mean.

Bible Believer said...

I agree it is all hypocrisy. I think of all the young people and am horrified by those who will think this festival of Satanic imagery, thought and action has anything to do with Christianity.

I understand people wanting to reach out to the tattooed crowd, but when they become like the culture they are in. What is the difference? They do not present any Christian truths. The new believers have to be confused beyond words. They probably are on the road to become ecumenists, buying the whole everything is 'blessed' by 'god" lie that they love to sell in Catholicism and beyond for everyone to embrace false religions. It definitely looks like they want them to "embrace" out and out overt satanism without a minute's hesitation.

These types and Calvary Chapel itself always condemns those who believe in separation, but what part of "come out of her" do they not get? They all decry biblical separation and this is what you end up with.

The whole mess to me is an AFFRONT to GOD. I actually when I saw the OWL picture, posted the entry within minutes. I felt it was so blatant and so horrible that something had to be said right away. I hate to say it this way, but for people to use imagery like this, and who love the darkness so much, it says what they are.

Where are the Christian elders and why are they silent? Where are these kids parents? With the apostate pastors directing these shows, discernment is GONE.

I thank God everyday He got me out of Calvary Chapel [my stay was very short] and showed me what it was about.

Bible Believer said...


Ive written this many times and its all over this blog, but I believe many of the pastors are KNOWING DECEIVERS.

We may not who is KNOWING or who is deceived themselves but there definitely is a network of knowing wolves who have infiltrated the churches [not just Calvary Chapel by the way] and who are making their influences known.

The benefit of the doubt can only go so far. When one sees the overtly Satanic presented, over and over and over again. IGNORANCE is not an excuse for the leaders. It may be for the kids and the new Christians but it is not for them. It just does not cut it. Add in the networks with the political system, Rome and far mroe that has been exposed and the picture grows even more darker.

So yes some may not be aware. Surely even some of their mid-levels think they are doing GOOD via their satanic rock n roll outreach, but I dare say the ones on top, it is too blantant to excuse it all as based in ignorance.

But that said,


Franklin Graham has even had horrible bands at his events.

Greg Laurie as well.

Aren't they hearing the same weird lyrics?

I believe things were changed in this country with the cultural revolution too, there were more's that were agreed upon that the cultural revolution wiped away such as monogamy and marriage. You are right even the non-Christians kept to certain standards which were later wiped away.

The pastors are the WORSE. I actually find myself asking why should anyone follow the lot of them? Their discernment is NIL, so many of them are WOLVES. And this applies to many churches. Surely a great number are deceived themselves but then why follow a man who is not shown even the basics by the Holy Spirit?

By the way in TWO YEARS of doing this BLOG, I think TWO and HALF, no pastor, or preacher has ever shown up here in agreement, save for ONE who was from a fundamentalist church in the Southwest and agreed with the article and ones who have stopped by to or sent their employees to protest articles..

This is a small blog, but I often think about that, tells you how much they are studying, which is not very much.

Where is your blog? I would like to see what you have written about Calvary Chapel.

Bible Believer said...

It is all dark...

I think about this with the music, how dark it all became. Even if you listen to music of 30-40 years ago that was popular, no make that further back before the hippies, it is much brighter. I have to admit even in books, I see much darkness promoted, little hope, and little happy endings.

Anon, you are right it does look like a death-cult.

If I were an unbeliever, and this is what I saw, I'd think it was some kind of a death cult.

To other anon:

That T-shirt is sickening and is definitely a blatant sign of what they are. He is making a handsign as well as his compatriot. The circle of chains is not a good sign either.

Anonymous said...

It is the honcho pastors and others like Franklin Graham who are promoting this hell. I believe that VERY MANY honcho leaders are actually satanic infiltrators. Notice they all target YOUTH ONLY. They obviously have an agenda and are plowing BIG, BIG money into their apple to make it overwhelmingly appealing to unwary worldly youth . They want to get their claws on the YOUTH. All of this has a completely masonic satanic signature imo

Anonymous said...

If you go to - in one of the tweets he tells his overly religious fans to pleez go away and stop scaring his people away from Jesus.

This strikes me so odd because looking at Welch would scare me away

I agree. They are taking advantage of these kids and leading them down a very scary road. One might say that thousands of kids accept Jesus at these concerts. But then what? Will they read the Bible? Will they go to church? What church? CC or some other emergent church that teaches ecumenism, contemplative or spiritual formation, yoga, baptism of the holy spirit or kundalini? I would be very curious what direction these saved people take.

shilosontheleft said...

With a live virus inoculation they strip away all of the parts of the virus that have effect upon the body so that the body will develop antibodies against the virus without having to experience the real viruses affects.
When the real virus comes along the body immediately rejects it.

These folks are stripping away real Christian experience and leaving a little Jesus Jargon and religious trappings which inoculates THESE KIDS from the real gospel when exposed.
This of course is evidence that these are NOT HIRELINGS.... these be Wolves...THESE KNOW what they are doing.

And your previous post about Franklin Graham and Satanic Masonic infiltrators.
Who do you think will take the reigns of CalChap when Charles passes?
Perhaps the one who was on the board for proven Mason BG?
It WILL BE Greg Laurie.... watch and see.

Anonymous said...

A couple of things said above by people, that I want to address.

Someone above wrote: **None of them say "Oh yeah I was a book reading atheist nerd, who collected stamps in my spare time"**

Seriously. I wish someone "big" would say something like that, just say, "Look, I was a boring little nobody that was lost, and then Jesus showed me Himself". Isn't that supposed to be the story anyway? Do we have to out-gross each other with how bad we were?

Paul did share some things, but he didn't go into deep detail about it, he didn't seem to wear clothing exalting it, and he sure didn't glory in it in speech. He was terribly ashamed of it and exalted the Lord for His mercy and grace.

Someone above also wrote: **You ever notice all these guys always have huge connections. You never see some preacher come out who lost his job at the factory and who previously lived on minimum wage. It's something I've noticed, just how connected all the CC pastors ARE. Extreme wealth**

Yes, that exact bell rung in my head when I read this too. How on earth did he become a big guy in music and art direction, designing lines of his boards and shoes and clothes, leading festival events? Not just because he walked in the door somewhere and said "I will now do all this". This wasn't someone that just fell into all that by accident. This was someone connected. Most of them are, they were this and that big position in the world, connected right up there. CC has that kind of connection thing all the time.

Another example, though he is not CC, John MacArthur, his dad had freemason connections and other ecumenical ties. There's always something.

I never hear testimonies of someone just saying "I was a nobody, nobody loved me, I was ignored by the world, I was down and out, no connections to anyone special, and then the Lord Jesus picked me up and here I am".

That would be a refreshing testimony, not to mention a very Biblical testimony (1 Corinthians 1:27).

Someone else wrote: **If you go to - in one of the tweets he tells his overly religious fans to pleez go away and stop scaring his people away from Jesus.**

When I hear people say things like that, I am done with them and their "ministry". Greg Laurie says things like that on occasion, and that's why I was done with him a long time ago.

The other main thing that drove me away from Greg Laurie was his comment that went "Wouldn't it be horrible to be 'almost' a Christian and then 'almost' miss heaven?"

That's works for salvation, which doesn't save. And it contradicts doing harvest crusades. If they come forward at a harvest crusade, and yet they might still miss heaven anyway, then why does he call anyone to come forward at all? And what are they coming forward then?

So the doctrinal confusion is rampant.

Anonymous said...

"One might say that thousands of kids accept Jesus at these concerts. But then what? Will they read the Bible? Will they go to church? What church? CC or some other emergent church that teaches ecumenism, contemplative or spiritual formation, yoga, baptism of the holy spirit or kundalini? I would be very curious what direction these saved people take"

First, the overwhelming majority of those that come forward, are rededications. Not that there is anything necessarily wrong with that, but don't assume that they're all new converts. Most are not.

And just using harvest crusades anaheim as an example, many are sent to TBN-type churches, ecumenical/emergent churches, and other problem places like that. In Australia harvest, they were sent to "church of christ" (water baptism regeneration lie), seventh day adventist, anglican, and other horrible houses of heresy.

shilosontheleft said...

I don't have my own blog...I've just posted a lot on other folks blogs.
I have been studying the CC phenom quite a lot....quite a story.
I sat under #2 CC guy for around 10 years though I traveled a lot so that was off and on.... never involved.
When I finally got involved what I saw was quite remarkable.
I saw a RCC man come in and start taking a big part and I decided he was a WATCHER!
WATCHIN' an old rogue asset is my guess.

Funny thing that ole # 2 bragged about more than once was how that shortly after leaving Shiloh (with all those boot prints on his rump) he said, THOSE EMERGING CHURCH FOUNDERS TRIED TO HIRE ME TO TEACH THEM HOW I WAS ABLE TO CONTROL SO MANY PEOPLE AT SHILOH..... THEY JUST DIDN'T GET IT.
Get WHAT one might ask.
That Shiloh was built on personality, slight of hand and lies.... and a LOT OF HELP FROM THE OUTSIDE... is my take on it.

Calchap, is the original SEEKER FRIENDLY CHURCH and is one of the keys to understanding what happened to the American Church.
California has always been trendy and the folks there tend to be FANS.
Now their FANaticism might be far ranging and even very much opposite of someone elses favorite ism but they love being FANS.
Understand this and you'll understand the Calchap phenom and the Christian music phenom.
It is all about being cool within the construct of your chosen fanaticism.
Of course this AGAIN approaches the Biblical term for the problem.
IDOLOTRY is the term folks.
IDOLOTRY explains all of this.

Ran across a thread on Rickross (yah... I know you don't recommend it) where this Methodist person talked of being involved in a Methodist Charity and woke up to find that the charity was taken over by a bunch of Atheists.
The Atheists were influencing the curriculum at Methodist schools and doing other antiChristian things.
Funny thing this person observed was that ALL THE ATHEIST USURPERS WERE EX CATHOLICS!
MY....doesn't that sound familiar!

So yah.... happening everywhere.
Calchap has a Knights of Malta CURRENT Catholic in CCCM leadership.
And what was General Jerry Boykin's last military specialty?
This could be made in to a suspense thriller by Hollywood!!!!

shilosontheleft said...

I WAS a Harvest Crusade Counselor once back around 1992.
They instructed us to not carry Bibles... only the Harvest print material hidden away and to pull it out once down in the pit area.
Well I always thought it was to fool those watching into thinking that all those folks going down were DECISIONS.
My experience was that there were 6 or 8 counselors for every DECISION.
Makes for GREAT TV.
If you are cynical like me... you see it as a form of MIND CONTROL.

Question to ponder:
How did Greg Laurie get a Christian hating secular press to keep this covered up for him?

Jeff Bynum said...

Historians always examine the ‘art’ of a culture to see how healthy, or sick, that culture was (is). Cultic “Christian” Rock is not the sickness of Christianity; it is only the putrefied rash that exposes the internal cancer of American Christianity. American Christianity has been dying ever since the late 1960s when traditional Protestant churches allowed neo-Pentecostalism to infiltrate their teachings and replace The Biblical, Jesus Centered, Gospel of trust in what Jesus has done FOR us (what he accomplished outside of us, in his Life, Death, and Resurrection) with a false-gospel of believer centered ‘experiences’. Cultic (man-centered) Christian music is only the logical outcome of American Christianity’s abandonment of The Gospel. The disease is not found in the choir, it is behind the pulpit (even those pulpits that hate rock n roll). It is certainly wise to warn against an evil substitute for Christ Centered music, but the real lesson to be learned from this is; Are we demanding that our pastors preach “Christ and him crucified” instead of the heresy of self transformation?

shilosontheleft said...

Yah Jeff, couldn't disagree more.
I remember the Traditional churches and THEIR arrogance and petty denominational wars.
This was the environment that made all this possible.
I came up through the 60s and a whole generation of young people were totally turned off by the TRADITIONAL CHURCHES and their judgemental petty contentiousness. (Contentiousness IS an ABOMINATION you know.)
Young folks were RIPE when a former Irish Catholic Thug from New York hooked up with Chuck Smith and a throwaway kid to bamboozle the young people with the NeoPentecostal heresies you blame it on.
But the core problem is not neopentecostalism.

I am not defending the craziness of Pentecostalism/NeoPentecostalism.
I saw with my own disbelieving eyes a teenage girl moving like a snake across the floor with contorsions that are humanly impossible... in a Pentecostal Church.
But this is NOT what created this mess.

Is Benny Hinn off the wall?
I say he's so far off of the wall he's going to hell.... and I wouldn't dare say that about a drunk passed out on the street.
But WHERE did Benny go and who did he bow down to recently?
Same guy Billy Graham bowed down to.
Same guy Kathryn Kuhlman bowed down to.
Same guy all but one Supreme Court Justices bow down to.
Same guy Wescott and Hort and Darby kissed up to.
And same as Chuck Missler.

What does Paul Crouch have in his foyer? longer in the foyer.....some folks were offended so he moved Mary/Cybele into a "cave" ... much more appropriate for a fertility cult statue anyway.. inside that "cave" I mean.

The REASON the problem is behind the pulpit is because those behind the pulpit were often educated by Jesuits!

I may have left CC but I'm not about to react and run off into some hardcore Calvinist holdover that Created the climate that allowed the RCC to recoup all that they lost to the Reformation.

We CAN agree that BIBLICAL Christianity is where we need to be.
And we can agree to pray that the Lord leads in that endeavor.

Bible Believer said...

Hi Anon

Yes they are TARGETING youth big time and it is on so many levels, they got the Dominionist Vision Forum types, working on them to make them blindly obedient and broken down:

and they got these types influencing them for other things, Emergent, mystical, one world church stuff, worldly, music with certain messages [hey it worked on society as a whole didn't it?]

It is the honcho pastors and others like Franklin Graham who are promoting this hell. I believe that VERY MANY honcho leaders are actually satanic infiltrators.

I believe many of the big names, and hmmm maybe even mid-level are knowing satanic infiltrators too.

They know they can easily influence the youth, in fact it is a given that independent thought in young people has grown far rarer even from the influence of popular media and what is taught to them in school.

Bible Believer said...

Brian Head tells people not to scare others away from Jesus?

What a strange thing to say. yeah if anything he is scaring them away.

I deal now with nonbelievers who tell me that Christians "scare them", "seem to be all about cruel right wing" politics. Hey so many avenues of keeping people away from the truth. The world will look at the false "testimony" of satanic rock n roll mixed with a "Christian veneer" and react accordingly.

The kids are being taken advantage of. Someone said innoculated. That is true. Hey I basically wrote that was the function of the Grahams and their multitude of crusades. False conversions. Add Greg Laurie to this list too.

Most of these crusades and rest have plenty of false churches involved. Even with the Graham ones they had the Catholics right there. So I suppose the kid would be directed to another apostate church for a false gospel, and false one world, Emergent and contemplative teachings.

Bible Believer said...

Sure you got it Shilos, it is a live virus innoculation...

Let them think they have been "born again" and well, it will be easier to walk away from what they thought was "Christianity" when the false conversion does not change their life or allow a true relationship with God.

It's is "jesus" as a fad, and something "trendy" they try once as a teen and put away and walk away from forever.

By the way, Ive met older versions of kids like this, "Oh I already tried Christianity, it didn't do anything for me", or "my parents took me a Graham crusade, and I got saved but in the end it didn't mean anything." Most are in full blown unbelief, either totally secularists or with some interest in other religions.

"Who do you think will take the reigns of CalChap when Charles passes?"

Greg Laurie, or Brian Broderson, but I could see it easily being Greg Laurie too.

Bible Believer said...

I agree with this

"Seriously. I wish someone "big" would say something like that, just say, "Look, I was a boring little nobody that was lost, and then Jesus showed me Himself". Isn't that supposed to be the story anyway? Do we have to out-gross each other with how bad we were?"

Yes I am waiting for that too. It really makes you wonder as all these preachers are so intent on being the biggest and baddest possible.

I know in my testimony, I admitted the UU stuff etc, but I regret all of it, and am horrified I was so misled. These folks seem like they are proud of their degenerate pasts When I read these testimonies, these pastors totally seem intent on having people see them as "cool, wild, rebels".

Bible Believer said...

Seriously when you all get a chance, skim through this book, and notice the trends with the "conversion stories"

Here is Greg Lauries [Do you all remember my article about Lonnie Frisbee dropping acid but in that case, saying He met God while doing so?]

"One day while working with a group of laborers dismantling a carnival, Greg was offered LSD. Greg dropped the acid while he worked, and soon was entering a new "spiritual" world where everything seemed to have hidden meanings.
Insights kept flashing into his mind. He even "transcended" the fact that he
almost got killed by a crane. In his mind this was a mere cosmic love tap. Greg was beginning to see eternity beneath the most ordinary things.

Greg had found a new purpose in life. He would pursue truth through LSD. As an individualist he resisted blind conformity to the hippie movement. Though helooked like any other hippie, he insisted on having his own thoughts. For that reason he did not take part in Eastern religions, nature worship, "be-ins," or
communes. But Greg fully embraced the wild freedom of the time. He continued
to use LSD regularly on weekends at friends' houses or in the California

At this time, Greg also began to notice a rather "uncool" group on campus. They were secure enough in their views not to care about social approval. They refused to conform to the new social revolution around them. In fact they seemed bolder than their extreme counterparts, even more than the wildest rebels who defied all morality, standards, and institutions. The heat of conflict
caused them to take a highly visible stand in this wildest of high schools. At lunch they often marched across the high school campus singing hymns and handing out tracts. Greg avoided them. They were Christians, the social lepers.

The amazing thing about them was that a number had been in the dope scene
much more deeply than Greg. Now they handed out tracts and smiled.
Every time Greg was handed a tract, he would look pointedly at the giver while
sticking the tract into his back pocket. Greg had a drawer full of them. For some
reason he never threw them away. And now and then he would get stoned, pull
them out of a drawer, read them, and laugh. But his laughter got rather thin at one point as he found himself on a bad LSD trip. He found himself in an unknown world. Greg discovered that it is a little hard to mock the idea of Hell when you really don't know what lies at the heart of existence."

Bible Believer said...

Continued from Harvest {Greg Lauries conversion story}

One day Greg and a friend decided to split a mega-dose of "orange sunshine"
LSD. He laid down and waited to soar into some unknown realm. Greg felt like a person with a pocket full of skeleton keys that could open one unknown door after another. The quality of the experience was strictly luck of the draw. Greg

Suddenly the air seemed to ripple like water. A wave of insanity swept through him. He felt distinctly that he was losing his grasp on reality. He also became conscious of a feeling of evil - a sort of presence, if you will. Previously LSD had seemed to have a safety switch. Greg felt he could always pull out and escape if
things got out of control. It was like toying with a dangerous situation without suffering the consequences, like watching a movie at one of those massive cinemadome theaters. The illusion of being in the action is so great you begin to
react to the images on the screen. In an action film, you experience the thrill of being close to death without having to suffer any potential consequences. Greg began to wonder if there really was a safety valve on LSD. He had heard of
people being killed by it or going insane. Could he be sure that he could bail out? What if the insanity did not go away? A new terror flooded him. As he felt himself going berserk, he wanted to stand in front of a mirror, perhaps to recapture who he was and remember his identity. As he stared his face started to melt. It aged hideously, then it deformed with monstrous contortions. Then something jagged ripped through him, a hideous, pealing laughter. "You're
gonna die! You're gonna die!"
Greg ran outside and tried to rip his clothes off. Neighbors stared out through shuttered windows. Greg's friends grabbed him and held him. He kept thinking, I'm in trouble, I need help. I may never get back to where I was.For months after that Greg felt that his brain was slightly fried. He realized that
he did not want to take any more LSD. The stakes were too high.


One day Greg felt drawn to a gathering crowd in the school cafeteria. The fellow speaking radiated joyous hope. He was in his twenties and had flaxen hair that
went down to his shoulders. He looked like tic had stepped out of a Bay Area
billboard advertising a concert like Big Brother and the Holding Company at
Golden Gate Park. In fact, judging from his words, he had done it all. But thisspeaker shared that he had come to the end of his long search - he had found the Lord. He was at Newport Harbor High that day to tell the kids why Christ (and not rock or acid) was the answer to every question they were asking. This
fellow was still in the honeymoon of his own conversion experience and was
feeling the thrill of it. His joy was infectious. So was his ability to evangelize boldly. Then he said something that brought Greg up short.
Greg had slipped into the back of the crowd. The last thing he wanted to be was a member of the "Jesus People" and become a social outcast. In the back of his mind, he knew deep down that God existed....

It goes on like this, Laurie is "saved" and almost has a severe car accident while on LDS....

Bible Believer said...

I agree Paul did share some things and he didn't go into deep detail. I ask myself where is the shame? These types do not seem to have it for their past. Where is the daily gratitude to the Lord for what He saved them out of?

Notice too they always KNOW each other. Ie, their star preachers never are just some guy that came up later, but always one who KNEW one of the BIGGIES, I have seen this in other denominations and with other churches besides Calvary Chapel. The younger ones always are introduced to the big whigs of the earlier generations which tells me the "star" preachers are CHOSEN. They do not come out of nowhere, and yes they always have HUGE CONNECTIONS. Here we see the class issues, ie, the poor working class guy who may even be a great preacher never has a chance in these circles. The CC pastors are all connected, as well as in other churches. Think about this guy's age--the pastor's son, how did he get all that BIG MONEY in music and art direction, which are both very highly competitive fields? It looks like he is still young now, so he accomplished that at a very young age. I remember reading Steven Furtick had multiple degrees and a giant church pastorship by the age of 28. How'd that happen? Where did all the money come from?Yeah look at the young ones who seem to emerge out of nowhere but then give the props to a long line of older apostates.
With Ries, yes definitely he did not fall into this by accident. And even the meeting of the newly supposed "Christian" Brian Head, was not by accident either, lest someone think we should believe that close friendships with Heavy metal rock stars and preacher's sons are normal.

Yes they all have connections. It can be seen in other places, so I can see that with John MacArthur and quite a few others. Even Doug Phillips of Vision Forum had a father who helped form the Constitution party. The links and connections go on and on.

Yeah you never hear anyone normal who says, I came out of nowhere, I was a nobody, who heard the gospel, repented and was born again. I know those are the true testimonies, but they are rare in any of these pulpits that is for sure.
I agree about the taint of "works salvation" with Laurie and the rest of them. That weird "almost" stuff is just to help mislead their audience.

I question the whole "altar call" thing which seems more based on human pride and a show of hands, rather then true biblical conversion.

Bible Believer said...

Thanks Shilos for explaining. Are there are other blogs I do not know of, that expose Calvary Chapel?

I wish I had more time to write, and want to remind people, I think the other denominations are just as bad, like Assembly of God etc.

I don't have my own blog...I've just posted a lot on other folks blogs.
I have been studying the CC phenom quite a lot....quite a story.
I sat under #2 CC guy for around 10 years though I traveled a lot so that was off and on.... never involved.
When I finally got involved what I saw was quite remarkable.

I am glad you saw through the CC too. So they had a Catholic come in, well not surprised there. Look at Laurie at Lifefest with a Catholic bishop who said Mass too.

What is the story with Shiloh? Was this a commune.

Found this online.

Isn't that where the Moses Berg connections come in?

Some Calvary Chapel pastors admit their time at Shiloh. Here is one.

"That Shiloh was built on personality, slight of hand and lies.... and a LOT OF HELP FROM THE OUTSIDE... is my take on it."

I would not doubt it.

"Calchap, is the original SEEKER FRIENDLY CHURCH and is one of the keys to understanding what happened to the American Church."

Well the Jesus Movement itself introduced what would later blossom into different strains of apostasy
You are right they definitely were the original Seeker Friendly church.

These were the days, they introduced all the new Christian fads and trends, and even though it took 30 years to get some of them mainstream they succeeded in their endeavors.

Don't forget they have labeled Chuck Smith the "father of the Jesus Movement"

And well considering the top of the blog article here, the WHOSOEVERS, they were the ones who introduced the marriage of rock to "Christianity. [CCM]
You are right it's all about being what people think is COOL and idolatry does form the undergirding,they worship their 'celebrity preachers', their music, this world, and NOT GOD.
As for usurpers coming in, you know I discovered the Jesuits are doing accreditation on the seminaries, here an example of a Seventh Day seminary but they are on the board for just about ALL OF THEM.

the whole system is one of usurption and subterfuge.

That is very interesting about Boykin's speciality, didn't know that. Reading another blog the other day, I saw that Boykin is the Grand Masters of the Knights of Malta just two spots under Papanicolaou

Bible Believer said...

About no Bibles and the Harvest Crusades, wasn't that rule instituted at BGs Crusades too? What a strange rule but says it all doesn't it? What kind of Christian preacher would outlaw Bibles?

I always wondered if they had other numbers at those things to make the audiences look bigger and those who all came forward. Just like reality TV, a lot of delusion presented as real. I see it as all based in showmanship, group dynamics, with huge dashes of mind control and knowing how to work crowds. I know some at my old IFB didn't like it when in front of a couple members I said, "shouldn't we do away with altar calls, everyone goes up in front [many who were previously saved already] and it looks like a contest for whose the most pious". I mean if you think about it, isnt the whole group dynamics of it WRONG? How many Christians get saved alone in their bedroom with their Bible at their side, praying and crying out to the Lord. Yes in the Bible they preached Gods Word to crowds and the gospel, but I don't recall any altar calls.

One thing these celebrities are always touted by the press, so that tells us something.

Jeff, I see the music as sympton too of the whole mess. Our art, definitely defines this culture, as sick and wicked. Look at the video games, the books, the TV shows that glorify death, and evil.
You are right about the new focus on the "experiences" instead of the true gospel in Jesus Christ. This is what they have desired to bring in and they succeeded.
" Are we demanding that our pastors preach “Christ and him crucified” instead of the heresy of self transformation?"

That heresy is something they are definitely committed to.

However I am with Shilos that many of the traditional churches were false as well. They helped set up the Pente, seeker sensitive, emergent invasion, as so many were daughters of Rome and steeped in their own religious errors and false doctrines.
There was a reason young people left the stuffy, liberal HIGH CHURCHES seeking after something new, and there Calvary Chapel and other false denominations were waiting for them.

EVEN TODAY they are setting up traps for those fed up with the church system. I warned people on this blog. The Emergents are going after even those who see the entire church system as falling away presenting them with false options. How many Christians who are in that wilderness of no fellowship or an assembly to be with will take that bait?

I know who Benny Hinn, Khulman all bowed down to...


As I have written before, when doing research for this blog, I follow Rev 17-18, it all goes home to Mystery Babylon and Rome.

And by the way Rome floated the Calvinist boat too as a daughter.

Never forget that is who it all orginated from.

Anonymous said...

Bible Believer:
Interesting comment about Steve Furtick. Here's another mega church pastor - young - with the trademark chin hair many of them sport. :-)

He says, "At 29, I became one of the youngest megachurch pastors in the U.S. as I inherited the leadership of the church where I served on staff. Before my 30th birthday, I had achieved the ultimate goal of many pastors...."

Here's his blog:
He suggests a number of books to read. All emergent authors.

I was thinking about what you said earlier - that the whole thing was orchestrated - The Whosoevers. They were put together for the purpose of misleading the youth. They know what they're doing.

The 10 minute interview with BHW is interestng.

He has a song Adonai

I will rise up a generation up to be my solidiers?
I will attack?
Rise, rise, rise up Adonai

Why do I get the sense he's not talking about God?
I kept thinking the black night rises.

shilosontheleft said...

MY wife's grandfather was a SDA missionary and I know that the RCC WAS anathema to the SDAs not long ago.
My friend at work is SDA and says they are being infiltrated also.

If you begin studying symbols and logos and such you'll soon realize that Satan IS the god of this world.
Most all of these new independent Emerging Churches have blatant occult symbols and themes.
It is their way of telling other mystery religion adherents they they "belong".
Also the whole HIDDEN IN PLAIN SIGHT thing is going on.. they think they get more spiritual power if they hide things in plain sight.

Almost ALL products you purchase have logos that hail from mystery religion origins.
I believe this is because they are all Free Masons.
Most FMs join to be successful in business and/or career... but many move up the chain and get weird.

YOU ARE CORRECT that THEY introduce their children to their CONNECTIONS but where do they GET the connections?
I believe the ultimate GOOD OLE BOY CLUB is the secret connection.
How DOES a NY Irish Catholic thug MEET a struggling Pentecostal minister and build a fantastically successful Christian movement?
At the local pub?
Don't think so.
At the beach?
Near nudity might help break the ice.
On a dating site?
Not if they don't have homosexual tendencies....and the World Wide Web was not even a thought back then. LOL!!!!

In the case of CC I would bet that the sudden growth in 1968 could likely be attributed to the press they got.. know anything about that?
Do you think Chuck had friends that could have helped in that way?
If he did....where did THEY meet?
In his 35 member church? LOL!!!

Question BB:
If it became public knowledge that Chuck Smith had a very visible CCCM staff member who is an active Mormon in good standing, do you think a lot.... MOST... CC attendees would kinda flip out and leave?
Well a Kights of Malta member is equivelant to a 28th degree Free Mason.
Now most know that there is very little difference between FMs and Mormons.
So how come there is not an aha(!) moment for CC attendees?

shilosontheleft said...

The whole thing about getting rid of the Bibles for the counselors I believe had to do with their not being visible.
If folks watching TV see a big ole Bible in the persons hand that came forward folks would realize they were not decisionees.
The BIG story here is why this was not a BIG STORY in the papers?
Seems it helps to have friends in key places.

Wrapped up in all this is the reason I think Laurie is the guy.
Broderson got the CCCM franchise for a cont'd good cash flow for the family.
Others have blogged about how Orange County has changed and both Harvest and CCCM are suffering in numbers because of this.
The Jumbotron CCs solve that problem as they will open THE WHOLE ENGLISH SPEAKING WORLD up to them!
And.... I heard.... they may use them to uhh... punish less than desirable problematic CC franchises.
I mean would a CCite rather go to Johnny Jerk's CC or a Greg Laurie Jumbotron CC across the street?
If you are conditioned to be an idol worshiper we know how that will go.
If the RCC ever completes their plan these Jumbotronors THINK they'll get to keep their own Fiefdoms.
Remember what Europe looked like when the RCC was in complete control?
Kings and Queens, Lord and Ladies, and Serfs..... IE Communism.

shilosontheleft said...

My take on the RCC is that it really is a melding of Simon Magus Gnostic Cults and Cybele worship.

The Vatican was built in 200 BC for Cybele.
The Magna Mater, a pine cone shaped black meteorite was brought in in 200 BC and stayed in the Vatican until the beginning of the 7 Century...or... about the time Islam was established and the Black Stone was set in its silver vulva encasement in the Kaaba in Mecca.

This Goddess cult was famous for sacrificing children and it's male priests who cut their junk off to become goddess nuns.
The child sacrifices stopped around 150 AD but returned with fervor (EVERY MASS) in 200 AD when melded with the Simon Magus Gnostic cults.

Simon Magus (Acts 8) was from Samaria which of course is where the Babylonians and Babylonian/Jew folks were made to stay on the Jews return from BABYLON.
Those in the Vatican and those RCC priests in the know today do NOT worship Jesus or even Mary mother of Jesus.
They worship the Goddess plain and simple.

Once you understand this you understand the hatred of the Bible, Bible Believing Christians, the Jews, the Tutsis in Rwanda, and people in general.
You understand why 25,000 Serb children were burned alive in furnaces by Roman Catholic Priests/Ustase Army Officers during WWII.
You understand why molesting children and raping women is endemic everywhere the RCC exists.

The Vatican appears to be making a play for the clearing house for all religions of the world administered from Jerusalem.
So.... the Temple they want us to contribute money to build is FOR THE ANTICHRIST FOLKS!!!!
It will likely be another bastard temple built to the wrong specs like the second temple was.
The Temple they want to build on the Temple Mount is for the AntiChrist

And YOUR local church is now embracing this murderous Gnostic cult.

Jeff Bynum said...

Yah shilosontheleft...
So the kids hated church and jumped into the false gospels of Benny Hinn and Kathryn Kuhlman. This was the alternative to the Traditional Protestant Church?
Well, I know just how boring Traditional Protestant Church was and is. This staleness was not a result of good teaching; it was the result of abandoning good teaching. Whenever the body of believers abandons Biblical Teaching, the devil always moves in with a counterfeit, and when believers fail to answer the devils counterfeit, the church eventually joins the counterfeit.
I certainly agree with your post. Protestantism has abandoned The Gospel and now teaches the False Gospel of The Roman Catholic Church. The only solution is the preaching of The Gospel of Jesus’ Life, Death, and Resurrection. However, these days it is not enough to preach what The Gospel IS, it is also important to preach what The Gospel IS NOT. When most Christians falsely believe that ‘being born-again’ is the Gospel (instead of being a RESULT of believing The Gospel of what Jesus has done FOR us, OUTSIDE of us) then it is imperative that we present a clear and precise definition of what The Gospel IS and IS NOT.

Anonymous said...

I watched the video of Brian Head Welch again on
Before you play the video you can see - it looks like he has a huge eye tattooed on his right elbow. Just in case we missed all the other signs of who he's really working for.

I was reading around. About P.O.D. and the rastafarian Jesus they have a picture of. Jesus with dreadlocks? So it fits that Welch has the dreadlocks. Members of Korn have the dreadlocks. I don't know a whole lot about rastafarianism - but I know it's not good, it's occult.

In the video Welch scratches his head and his face a lot. He plays with his dreadlocks and rolls them around in his fingers. Ew. The second half of the video he has his hand in front of his mouth.

He picks a tattoo is explan and it's a tattoo of Korn's album cover Untouchables with the kids faces. He said people wonder why he got it after he left the band.

He got it because he didn't really leave!

Yes, the temple is for the anti-christ. The Bible is telling us that satan is the god of this earth for a reason. Lots of good info, shilosontheleft. Thanks.

Anonymous said...

"Others have blogged about how Orange County has changed and both Harvest and CCCM are suffering in numbers because of this."

That's a fact. Demographics have so changed in Orange County and Riverside County. CC has traditionally been a white person church for the most part, and millions of white people left those counties, and thousands more leave every year. Lots of people that stayed in those counties, also ended up at Rick Warren's satellite churches and other like churches.

"The Jumbotron CCs solve that problem as they will open THE WHOLE ENGLISH SPEAKING WORLD up to them! And.... I heard.... they may use them to uhh... punish less than desirable problematic CC franchises. I mean would a CCite rather go to Johnny Jerk's CC or a Greg Laurie Jumbotron CC across the street?"

That's already happening in some places. CC will eat itself.

Bible Believer said...

Yes why do all those pastors have goatees? more and more while I know some innocent men take it as a fashion in the religious world it seems to be serving as a marker of some sort. How many of the young ones, DON'T HAVE ONE?

How many 29 year olds suddenly become the owners of giant businesses? or CEOS unless they were born into a family where the father or grandfather started the business?

Looks like he has the Emergent thing going and the Dominionism as well, notice how they always want to TRAIN everyone.

"Parkcrest will become known not only as a church for people who are far from God to connect with God, but as a training ground…a training ground for every day, ordinary Christians to live out their faith in exponential and multiplying ways. A training ground for people who are called into vocational ministry to be prepared not just to lead in a church, but to see the kingdom expanded."

I think they CHOOSE secular rock stars, vett them, train them, MK ultra them [some will know what I mean with that] so why not some led into the religious entertainment arm of the new world order/beast system?

I agree they are there to influence the young people and some of the plans are probably even long term in approach.

So he played with his old rock band Hmmm What does the Bible say about a dog returning to his vomit?

2 Peter 2:2

But it is happened unto them according to the true proverb, The dog is turned to his own vomit again; and the sow that was washed to her wallowing in the mire.

Shows more fruits of a false conversion.

Why would you need to tell God to "rise up"?

Jesus is Risen.

Yeah I think they are calling on another entity to RISE. Creepy.

Yes I saw the eye tattoo on the arm, very creepy. Not good at all.

I have more to say but have to get offline now.

Anonymous said...

Goldsworthy also talked about being a movement. The whosoevers claim to be a movement. Its interesting to see parallels. The new age movement.

The video of welch was so disturbing to me. His mannerisms and eyes were just strange. He said they were being usEd to bless people. I think they are being used. But not to bless anyone.

Bible Believer said...

Shilohs that is interesting about your wife's grandfather. Well I know for fact they tell the people in the SDA pews or USED to tell them, that Rome was the harlot and false, but there is Dr. Beach going to get a medal from the Pope, they have their United Nations office too. Yes the hirelings lie in a variety of capacities. I believe the SDA is a cult and probably there is some Jesuit influence back there somewhere.

One thing I do not believe they were infiltrated so much as their roots have to be somewhere in Rome. There are people of course in that church who do seek after God's Word and desire the truth but the baggage from Ellen White and other false teachings is IMMENSE.
I agree about the occult symbols.

Make sure you check out what is shown about the SDA symbol here. Scroll down midway...

It's all over the place. The Saturn "Swooshes", Torches, Sun Symbols etc.

It's a sign for others in the know...

I definitely believe the freemasonic networks definitely play a role in this. Of course Freemasonry for the majority most think it is just a philanthropy club. The ones higher up like the 33rd degrees know..

Once a person figues out the Freemasons really "work" for the Pope and all the "knights" and others are directed, from above, it makes for an interesting picture.

It is definitely a GOOD OLE BOY CLUB, and their own children definitely are brought in to it all.
HEy they all get press, some big newspaper guy was even told to "puff up" Graham.

So there is a Mormon of high standing in the CCM? Well besides Glenn Beck who is praised from so many of their circles..

Hey consider Romney...[the religious right joined around the MORMON candidate]
moment for CC attendees?

Oops looks like that's already been removed...

off youtube too.

Bible Believer said...

What is the deal with the jumbotrons, they want to sell church via videos. I know some of them do that with campuses putting the big man preacher on video, and that's the only way, some see him. Why not just stay home and watch TV then? It's all a show.

Bible Believer said...

RCC sure, its all about Mystery cults, and Simon Magus and Cybele/Diana [different names goddess here] worship.

I've written on the kabba stone before. That stone from Jupiter.

Yeah that's what sitting in Mecca.

ct 19:35 And when the townclerk had appeased the people, he said, [Ye] men of Ephesus, what man is there that knoweth not how that the city of the Ephesians is a worshipper of the great goddess Diana, and of the [image] which fell down from Jupiter?

and the meteorite is encased in a YONI shape, SYMBOL of the goddess.

Yes human sacrifices, and sun worship and all aspects of paganism warned about in the Bible, Rome still has the eunuch priests [just no castration today] and vestal virgin [nuns]

worship of the goddess is in every false religion.

the daughter of chaldea...
You are right they do worship the goddess just calling her Mary.

When I figured that out, I figured out the full picture, some years ago. There are 60plus articles that expose Rome on this website so it is one area, I have delved into. If you haven't read them yet, make sure you read this one.

They are still worshiping Diana

"The Vatican appears to be making a play for the clearing house for all religions of the world administered from Jerusalem.
So.... the Temple they want us to contribute money to build is FOR THE ANTICHRIST FOLKS!!!!"

Yes this is the plan, and they have all the religions set up as pawns including the majority of evangelicals and their apostate hireling leaders. Why else all the emphasis on the KINGDOM BEING HERE ON EARTH-DOMINIONISM, on the TEMPLE here, and The Rapture?

I wrote about their would be false temple that so many of those false teachers lust for.

People forget is that the world will embrace the ANTICHRIST as being "God." ["jesus" returned]

The Pope wants his temple in Jerusalem to deceive the world.

Everything traces back to Rome.

Bible Believer said...

When I hear the word "movement" I want to run.

Where do they want to MOVE you too?

Anyone should ask that question.

God does not change, but these folks sure change the game plan every 20 minutes.

I didn't watch the video of him. Their eyes look strange to me in all the pictures. Ok I went I turned it on for a few seconds, that's all I needed to see that something is very wrong. You all probably can guess what I think that is.

Anonymous said...

Bible Believer - is it the big eye ball tattooed on his elbow that he flashes in your face?

shilosontheleft said...

The 60s/70s youth did not follow Benny Hinn, he came along much later.
KK was a mentor to Chuck Smith.... and is one of those who got her audience with the pope.
Never had a crusade event without filling the stage and front rows with priests and nuns.
She buddied up to Billy Graham I believe.... a known Free Mason.
Reportedly, she also was the "bagman" that gave lotsa bucks to Lonnie Frisbee... which he promptly blew in Las Vegas! LOL!

I agree that teaching what the gospel is and isn't is extremely important today.
I have been studying the dark side the last few years and am astonished at how much occult and ACUTAL SATANISM is in the church but the church is too ignorant to know it.
I often get the cliche, DON'T LOOK AT THE DARKNESS".
I say, "The Bible says, MY people perish for lack of KNOWLEDGE."
Christians are now reading THEIR OWN SATANIC VERSES.... called THE MESSAGE.
The seminary trained pastors are JUST AS IGNORANT AS THEIR CONGREGATIONS!!
Well... a few aren't... they are not hirelings... they are wolves.

shiloisontheleft said...

We know of course that all of the goddesses are Semiramuc, WHORE OF BABYLON.
But curious if you have knowledge of the Magna Mater....pretty much the oldest Goddess from Asia Minor after the flood I've read, is she the exception?
Is she BEFORE Babylon or after?
Is the Magna Mater evidence that the ancient preflood pagans worshiped the goddess also?

There is a distinct disconnect between the average RCC adherent and the Vatican.
Adherents do worship Jesus and Mary but Jesus is generally not the same Jesus that Bible Believers worship.... and Mary definately is not the Mary mother of Jesus of the Bible.... though THEY think she is.
I do not believe the Vatican even does this.
It is reported that the driver of the popemobile said, when the John Paul II was shot he prayed to the Black Madonna.
I think the black madonna is the pine cone shaped Black Stone that was brought to the Vatican in 200 BC... the Magna Mater (Mountain Mother.... think she was from Tennessee.)
Now some say Semiramus was a drop dead gorgeous black woman... evidence that SHE is the black Madonna.
And she was a perpetual VIRGIN.... obviously different criteria involved.
Maybe that is evidence that the Magna Mater came about after the Babylon dispersion in Genesis.

At any rate I believe that the Vatican is STILL involved in the trappings of Cybele worship.... scary stuff.

Bible Believer said...

The queen of babylon, Jer 44, comes under multitudes of names. I guess I never have heard Magna Mater but there are hundreds of different names within different cultures and places. I agree the average RCC adherent most are just deceived. Some are even interested in God but sadly being fed lies and a false gospel. The "black" Madonna's are called "black" not due to race but because they are said to come from the "earth". The RCC does worship another "jesus" even in their idol the Eucharist. The Vatican definitely is still involved.

Bible Believer said...

shilos go check out the Jack Schaap thread, acouple defenders so far.

So when the wicked priests take advantage of kids, we are supposed to give this guy with his false doctrines, abusive sermons and admitted affair with a teenager girl sent to him for counseling for "sexual abuse!" a past?

So many are swayed by that front man in the pulpits. I more and more believe the front man-one guy running the place program comes from Nicolatians rather then any true Christian church.
KK definitely promoted ecuemnism, priests and nuts and her visit with the Pope, I believe there is a picture somewhere on this blog of her and the Pope. There is also a video where Khulman is with Lonnie Frisbee and seems to be giving him a ton of hand signs and appears to be acting as a "handler" of sorts.

Many have watered down the gospel, they put a slight Christian "veneer" on absolute lies, so yes teaching what it "isn't" is very important too.

There is actual Satanism in the church. They have pastors practicing OVERT OCCULTISM.

I posted about some here.

WITCHCRAFT right out in the open.

I know on this blog I have to cover some dark stuff, one has to make sure they don't swim in it, but at the same time, I believe it is important to expose what is going on.

I agree the pastors are just as ignorant, well some are as deceived as their congregants, while others are the knowing types.

Bible Believer said...

correction, past should be PASS above...

Lisa Ruby said...

Bible Believer wrote, "I hate seeing young people led into false Christianity and even influenced to embrace the world via bands like this. Even more sickening is they are invited to play right in the churches."

I agree. They are won, via a satanic medium, to a world-loving "brand" of Christianity that is foreign to the bible.

Lisa Ruby said...

Bible Believer wrote, "I hate seeing young people led into false Christianity and even influenced to embrace the world via bands like this. Even more sickening is they are invited to play right in the churches."

I agree. The youth (and their parents) are deceived into thinking they can tack "Christ" onto their world-conforming lives. Rock music is an idol. The bible commands God's people to flee from idols, not exalt them.

Woe will come to the "pastors" who govern the businesses that pose as churches and subvert the people into thinking they are saved when they are no more saved than the "pastor" who preaches peace, peace (with God) when there is no peace.

Lisa Ruby said...

The words, "Pray Hard" look like they have been written in blood.

This article is hard to read, Bible Believer. It must have been even harder to write. Thank you for keeping us informed.

Bible Believer said...

Hi Lisa,

I agree this is a satanic medium with a false "Christianity" that is of the world. Basically led under the antichrist. They are deceived and think they can mix the world and Christianity. I agree about rock music being an idol. I have not had time to write about rock music, but if one reads the lyrics of even the mainstream popular bands, they ARE against God, they do brainwash people into NWO agendas, they do advance fornication, and lust, and materialism and a whole range of sins. I have seen the affect of rock music on people I know and it is very very strong. They know they can strongly influence these young people through it too.

Pray Hard as well as many other slogans on those posters and pictures, definitely look like they wrote them in blood. The focus on the colors black and red are for a reason too.

Yes this one was a hard one to write. Sometimes what I found out is so horrendous, and this was one of those times. I can't put my head in the sand, and have to tell it like it is on this blog. I feel horrified for all the young people and have prayed for those who may encounter this "band".

Anonymous said...

I realize the California falling into the Pacific was a "tongue in cheek comment"...BUT...this is news

apparently there was an earthquake in Orange County!

Anonymous said...

I just discovered that Lecrae, another Calvary Chapel favorite who does hip hop/rap, wears Obey clothing.

Bible Believer said...

Obey clothing...subliminals for those in the pews and in the world?

I hated the stuff when I saw it years ago. Wondering who would wear that type of stuff like they are a blind automaton of the system. Hmmmm

Bible Believer said...

Thanks for informing us about a new California earthquake, I would suspect given the increase of earthquakes in the world that may not be the safest place someone could be.

Anonymous said...

Welch is giving support to Cherry Bomb, an all girl band aged around 14 y.o. It broke my heart to see the worldliness in these young girls watching one of their videos.

The Whosoevers are supporting a band called Write This Down on thier blog. The first thing I thought of is new age writers who channel their works. One of the things they are told is to "write this down". Beth Moore and Helen Schucman come to mind right away.

The Whosoevers also on thier blog have a video by a christian death metal band called Impending Doom.

christian death metal?

Diana A. said...

My teenage daughter mentioned to me that the Whosoevers were at a porn convention, here in California promoting God. They also just posted a recent picture with Lil Wayne telling their fans not to judge but to love on the lost. What kind of message is this sending to our youth?? We are pretty upset with the leaders at CCCM as to why they would promote such a movement. Raul Reis was on TBN as a guest speaker promoting his son a couple of years ago. What is Raul Reis doing on TBN?
I looked into their website to find out that CHI the guy they are constantly raising funds for is a heavy metalalist that is not a Christian. They have never mentioned the need to pray for his salvation. Please pray for more Christians to stand up against this heresy and for California. I live in California and appreciate prayers more than wishing we were wiped out:(
“You adulterous people! Do you not know that friendship with the world is enmity with God? Therefore whoever wishes to be a friend of the world makes himself an enemy of God.” (James 4:4)

Bible Believer said...

Hi Diana A,

I will pray for people in California and DO NOT want anyone wiped out. Just so you know. :) I do think they start many wicked movements in California which isn't a condemnation of all who live there, but simply because California is such a cultural center and they know via Hollywood etc, things will spread.

Thanks for sharing. So they have hung out at a porn convention, that is really bad.
I have noted the contact with worldly stars and other celebs. Is this the Lil Wayne picture?

With TBN, just about all the Calvary Chapel leaders have been on there, Chuck Smith etc...

Bible Believer said...

Is this the cherri bomb band? Do they consider themselves Christian too?

or is it secular?

More awful, strange lyrics...[that applies to just about every popular band now]

Hmm "Write This Down" like channeled writings...

As for that band Impending Doom...

Yeah that is actually considered a real music genre [barf] along with Christian heavy metal and believe it or not "Christian goth"

"Impending Doom is a Christian death metal band from Riverside, California. The group has released four full-length studio albums and are currently a four piece with vocalist Brook Reeves as one of the two original remaining members along with Manny Contreras who left the band in 2010 but returned in 2012. The band refers to their style of music as "Gorship", which is described by Reeves as "Worshiping God through our gore-sounding music"."

Sigh...Poor young people all these really bad influences on them....

christian death metal?

Bible Believer said...

Link for the above quote..

Oh you got to be kidding me...

"The band also created their own symbol called the "Repentagram" combining the words repent and pentagram. The band explained the Repentagram with the following:

“We’ve gotten a lot of mail questioning the Repentagram Logo, I would like to take time right now to explain it to you all. First off we are a christian band and a real one at that, we would never put something out that had satanic meaning or anything negative. We thought up the word “REPENTAGRAM” basically putting two words together. 1. REPENT (meaning: to feel such sorrow for sin or fault as to be disposed to change one’s life for the better; be penitent.) 2. PENTAGRAM (which in the dark metal world is a satanic symbol.) Since we are a Christian death metal band we wanted to think up something clever; thus the Repentagram came into thought. It is not the same amount of sides as a pentagram, we are going for making a Christian death metal symbol. Just like we created the word “GORSHIP” (which as you all should know, does NOT mean worship gore, it means worshiping God through our Gore sounding music) the Repentagram is just the new word. Please pass this information along to anyone you may know that thinks anything more than it really is.""

Overt and blatant mixing in the things of Satan.

Anonymous said...

Yes, that's the band Cherri Bomb. From Welch' Facebook page he says: "I hope this band Cherri Bomb gets big, they've worked hard & they're 14 - 16 yr old girls"

I don't think they're pretending to be Christian.

I was looking at the Whosoevers Facebook Brasil page. Welch's band Love and Death picture from July 5th has one of the guys with his eyes whited out like a zombie. There's also a picture of people praying at the porn convention.

One thing I have noticed in one of my friends who listens to this, is that she has become a bit more - how do I describe it - a bit more crude, hard, in her speech. But when the spirit of Baal is behind this . . . On the Whosoevers store the people modeling the clothes try to look so hard, so tough. It's like, where's the peace, contentment, joy in your eyes? There is none!

Anonymous said...

Also, on the Brasil Whosoever Facebook page, around July 3 or 5, around there, there's a picture of a woman - Mary? With triskeles or triquetras all over her shroud and she's wearing a gas mask with an explosion going on behind her. Again, what's with the gas masks in all these bands pictures and logos?

Anonymous said...

There's a lot of cookie cutter Christians in here! You guys will never reach the streets like the whosoevers can and it's not a band it's a family full of the people you all threw out of YOUR churches! Why don't you all check out the Facebook site and you will see what they do with Jesus. Don't tell me POD is worthless cause they were the ones that helped bring me to Christ.

Anonymous said...

To anon Aug 16th. The problem is that the Christ they are leading you to is not the Jesus Christ of the Bible. They are preaching another Jesus. Please read your Bible.

For if he that cometh preacheth another Jesus, whom we have not preached, or if ye receive another SPIRIT, which ye have not received, or another gospel, which ye have not accepted, ye might well bear with him (2nd Corinthians 11:1-4).

False teachers talk about Jesus all the time. Jim Jones talked about Jesus and he had his flock commit suicide.

People in the new age movement use Jesus and the Bible to say that the kundalini awakening, or baptism of the holy spirit is a good thing, but it'a actually demonic.

The Calvary Chapel I left the pastor said that every Chrisian should learn to get the baptism of the holy spirit. This is not biblical. This is demonic.

Frank Pastore on KKLA is on you tube at a Whosoever conference. Frank Pastore also said on his show that every Christian should learn spiritual formation (contemplative prayer). Frank Pastore has Dallas Willard on his show and tells us how wonderful this guy is. He is all about contemplative practices. This is also demonic. This is a new age practice. We are not instructed anywhere in the Bible to seek a baptism of the holy spirit, nor to practice contemplative prayer.

The Bible tells us to avoid every type of witchcraft, wizardly, divination, talking to the dead. To avoid every appearance of evil. The Old Testament is full of stories of what happens when people do this and how it ruins them. So when Frank Pastore was touting the wonderfulness of Harry Potter and how he used witchraft for good, it makes my stomach turn.

Luke 11:35 says to Take heed therefore that the light which is in you be not darkness.

When I see the satanic and Nazi imagry on The Whosoevers Facebook page and blog I feel so sick to my stomach. My heart has felt so heavy and burdened the last few weeks looking at this stuff.

When I read the Bible and take into my heart its words and God's promises I get a peace and contentment that, as the Bible says, surpasses all understanding.

Please don't be deceived. These days are so wicked. Please pray and read your Bible. If you ask God to show you the truth, He will show you. You are in my prayers.

The Bible tell us to not be conformed to this world, but be transformed by the renewing of our mind. This happens when we read the Bible and ask God to mold us into the person He wants us to be. You will see things in a totally new light.

Satan is the great counterfeit. He is a liar and a murderer. He wants to do any and everything to separate you from the true Jesus Christ. The Bible tell us to be sober and alert, because satan prowls around like a roaring lion to see who he can devour.

For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places, EPH 6:12.
The Bible also says that satan is the ruler of the skies. He is the ruler of this earth. God tells us these things in is word to warn us and instruct us. He loves us to much and wants the best for us. When we do what tickles our ears and flesh instead, we will get in trouble.

If a cookie cutter Christian is one that loves Jesus Christ and wants to obey Him and read his word to know what he wants me to do, then that be me!

The Bible also says that in the last days many will fall away and follow doctrines of demons. Please read your Bible. It's the only way to get true discernment and God's wisdom. We must seek God's wisdom, not man's.

Proverbs 3 tells us to ask for wisdom, common sense, good judgment. God wants to give us these things!!

....Blessed are those who find wisdom,
those who gain understanding,
14 for she is more profitable than silver
and yields better returns than gold.
15 She is more precious than rubies;
nothing you desire can compare with her. .....

Anonymous said...

Why did the person say "these are the people you threw out of your churches"???

We didn't throw anyone out of our church. People in our church do have tattoos and piercings and such. Why would they get thrown out of a church for having these things?

Another straw man argument, nonsense.

Anonymous said...

A woman I know said she likes Calvary Chapel because they said she could listen to any kind of music she wanted to and she wanted to keep listening to the Beatles. I said, but the Beatles were into the occult. She changed the subject quickly, and I thought why as a Christian would you want to listen to a group that ridiculed Christianity, that ridiculed Jesus, that was into Eastern religion, had Aleistar Crowley and Adulous Huxley as favorite people on their album cover . . . It's the spirit of rebellion. I'm going to do what I want to do. That spirit of defiance.

Bible Believer said...

Sorry about your friend growing more hard in her speech. There are influences in this society where they are telling people to become "more hard". I found myself telling someone I know the other day, "do you want to become like those who have chosen hardness for good?" They are influencing the young and others to become like this.

I am writing an article now called the Erosion of Love and Conscience for this blog, it's taking me some time, I know it has to do with these issues in an overall manner where people are being influenced a certain way and it's not just affecting the young but adults. It is a deep change even in how people look out upon the world. When I look at those bands, and trust me I remember when I adopted those attitudes when young via the secular rock world, the so called "Christian ones" in their body language and more, show the same hardness, false manufactured rebellion, dead eyes, grim looking stances. Some may say that is so they can sell more records, but they are being just like the world! There is no joy, peace or contentment. There is nothing Christian about it. These folks aren't even just trying to mimick ordinary, but the iconography of "death metal, goth, and the most satanic riddled secular music genres.

Bible Believer said...

I see the gas masks all over the place too. Even in the areas of the "art world". I am not sure what that is supposed to represent, more war and hopelessness?

Bible Believer said...

How did we throw anyone out of the churches when many here including ME, left the churches OURSELVES?

Just so you know the writer of this blog used to listen to very bad music before she became a Christian, goth, heavy metal, industrial rock. When I repented, I knew to leave those things behind outside of AGING out of them too. Why do the Whosoevers and POD keep to the same things the world does?

They will tell you it's all about being cool and "accepting" those who are different. The latter part is ironic as those under the sway of these things, all dress, act and speak alike. If someone was to be peculiar, I would rather it be for the Lord, rather then trying to be "cool" like the world.

These bands are keeping young people in the darkness and leading them to it.

1 Peter 2:9 But ye are a chosen generation, a royal priesthood, an holy nation, a peculiar people; that ye should shew forth the praises of him who hath called you out of darkness into his marvellous light;

Bible Believer said...

I agree with my commenter that these bands are leading people to "another christ" the one of satanic music, false emergent teachings, and experiential mysticism. I can tell the mysticism is even influencing so many CCM lyrics out there, that is why they are strange and read like semi-Buddhist Koans. They do not teach biblical doctrines or teach true biblical repentance or sing praises of God. One thing I have noted is the music always refers to "christ" if they are even bothering to depart from third person pro-nouns, so yes who is the music to? Not to Jesus Christ but another 'christ".
As I have written on this blog, there are many who say they know jesus and they do not. False teachers like Jim Jones and even the Pope have used the name "jesus".

I guess I am not surprised they are bringing in the contemplative prayer stuff. Well the lyrics themselves are written in a certain way for mysticism, I've analyzed a few songs but have read enough of the phony ODD lyrics to see where they are leading beyond other false messages.
My stomach turned too when I saw the Whosoevers blog, I decided to write this article right at the point I saw that "owl" picture. Christians who see the parade of DARKNESS before us, we KNOW IT IS EVIL. These bands GLORIFY that what is DARK and is seen RIGHT there in front of our eyes.

I have felt like crying for the young people being deceived like this. It is horrific to me. There too like my commenter, I turn to God's Word for peace and understanding. I agree, please do not be deceived. Remember Satan is a subtle deceiver. Just because these bands call themselves "Christian" does not mean they are!

I am praying for you too.

Anonymous said...

Actually, that was a pretty mild comment by the person sticking up for POD and the Whosoevers. Sometimes when false teachers are pointed out their followers can get very mean and vicious to the messenger.

I used to listen to heavy metal in the 80s and went to a number of concerts. I had a couple of boyfriends who played in bands. It's a very rough life. When I turned to Jesus, these things lost all interest to me.

Guitarist for life 15 said...

To be honest i see nothing wrong with the images i see. yes these images and music is radical and a bit out there. But this is how todays generation, my generation is. the music yes doesn't mention god as often or bluntly as othe artist do but that doesn't mean it doesn't have a deep meaning that does have God being the main meaning behind these songs. the music P.O.D and the whosoevers perform relate to the hurting youth of today. its hard hitting and blunt and honest and real to the fact of the inner pain youth today feels. and this music shows that through all the pain and hurt and addiction and self-condemnation God is the answer to take it all away. the images you see are radical but not "evil" or "satanic", atleast not in my eyes. to be honest the fact that you know so much about these satanic symbols kinda concerns me. all im saying is to give it a chance and actually pray about it instead of leaning on your own understanding... im a 16 year old young man and i listen to this music. and im pretty sure God has his hands over me and protecting me...

Bible Believer said...

I thought they were polite, yes some of the defenders of these things can become mean. I've faced that too.

Thanks for sharing your experiences too of listening to heavy metal music. I used to go to concerts too and I listened to the worse of the worse. You are right that is a rough life, when I became a Christian I was done with all the old music too.

Bible Believer said...
This comment has been removed by the author.
Bible Believer said...

To Guitarist for life, I am glad you see that some of the images are radical. Remember when I was young, I didn't know the meaning of images I talk about here, that took time and study. My worry is that while the young people listening to this music are well-meaning they are being taken places they should not be and it goes even beyond the images but the skewing of Christianity and even more subtle deceptions. When one becomes a Christian, and saved, via the Holy Spirit they want to leave the things of the world behind. When I was young, I listened to the WORSE music, even GOTH, and what was called in the late 80s INDUSTRIAL music..I know that I was entranced with the lyrics, the music, I listened to actually influenced my then UU pagan Theosophical beliefs {here is my testimony}--

The music does have deep meaning to it. I even looked back at the lyrics of one of my favorite bands for years, this was a goth band, and they were actually singing praises to the Daughter of Chaldea and the Antichrist in the music. This was beyond the obvious pentagram they used on the front of one album with a face in it. I know you are young but they do bury "messages" in the music so to speak. Subtle deflections and distractions and in this "Christian" rock, I have discussed the strange lyrics, that depart from what the Bible tells us. You do want to go where God wants you to Right? Realize Satan has many workers to steer even Christians wrong.

There is a lot of cults, and other groups who will use words like God and even Jesus but be teaching things totally against God's Word.

And yes you are right they do reach out to hurting youth. I know one reason I followed the secular music I did when young was some of the same reasons. But this is what is so terrible to me, they are taking advantage of the pain but instead of leading the young people out of the darkness they are bringing forth more of in the dark art, the lyrics. Remember here, the world calls a lot of things COOL which are DARK. Why has that happened"? Think about this, the colors focus on BLACK, instead of yellow for instance.

They will present themselves as relating to you, and being sensitive to "the pain" but it is a way of deception. Same as other things in the world such as some of the false things in psychology and more.

You may think they are leading you to "god" but right now this world is in a spiritual battle and many are being led to a false 'god" and a false "christ" of another gospel. Ask yourself this, if Jesus Christ showed up and saw the imagery of this band, with the dark pictures and even the band members wearing T-shirts with pentagrams on them, what would He think?

Jhn 8:12 Then spake Jesus again unto them, saying, I am the light of the world: he that followeth me shall not walk in darkness, but shall have the light of life.

One thing it is not easy for me to know so much about these symbols, and some of this is from my own past [UUs study ALL religions which mean learning quite a bit about symbols and more out there]
but then God does not want Christians living in ignorance too. He wants to show them the truth and those on top who choose these symbols who do so KNOWINGLY {I admit many use them not knowing but are influenced} know exactly what they are doing.

I did go look up the lyrics, and listened to some of the music in writing this article. Just please think about what I have told you but overall, pray to God to show you the truth. You may have found this website for a reason, and for God to warn you and you reading this article could have even been His protection.

Anonymous said...

So there's no problem with radical images that a christian band is projecting? It doesn't make sense to me. When I was young I was into Black Sabbath, Led Zeppelin for starters. Black Sabbath was/is full of images of skulls, devils, black and red colors, etc. And now you have the Whosoevers - full of images of skulls, devils, colors of black nd red - for starters. How does that distinguish them from the world that we are not supposed to be a part of? The Whosoevers and their sites look so dark and depressing. Faith in Jesus Christ is not dark and depressing! It doesn't make sense.

I think it just boils down to people not wanting to believe the Bible. They want to do what they want to do, not what God wants us to do. And The Whosoevers lead them to just such a jesus. Again, it's not the Jesus of the Bible. Remember, Satan is the great counterfeit. He is happy as long as people are not following the Jesus of the Bible. That's the key.

Like you said, BB, they say they are helping kids in pain, but they are leading them to darkness!

BB hit it on the head. When you surrender to Jesus Christ, you read the Bible, pray, the Holy Spirit shows you. I see the world in a totally different light. It was a process - it didn't happen overnight. But you are changed. Jesus Christ released me from some horrible bondage that I thought I would die from. When I came to him with a contrite heart and really meant it, he changed me - such a marvelous thing. I want to do what God wants me to do. I am so grateful. I look at what the Whosoevers are doing and it grieves my heart so much.

God instructs us in the Bible what to do - he does it for a reason. He knows what is good for us. We do not know what is good for us. When he says if you friends with the world you have enmity with Him. There's a reason for it. James 4. The spirit behind the world is spirit of the one who rules the air.

Thank you again Bible Believer for writing about this.

Anonymous said...

It seems the whosoevers can get away with the satanic symbolism with the youth since they may not know about the holocost and nazi symbolism. So they just think its cool. The triqueta they use was a trademark of led zeppelin. Jimmy page bought aleistar crowleys house. I was exposed to so much symbolism on heavy metal albums - they were trying to be evil and scary! And now much of this same symbolism and color schemes are found on the whosoevers sites? What is that about? It's for the kids? Are you kidding me? Being aware of - not submerged in - occult things is like being aware of the poisons in your house and how to handle them. Like bb said, we are in a spiritual battle for our minds. We need to put on our armor, just like the Bible tells us to. Please read the Bible, pray for discernment, and you will be amazed. Read what happened to king solomon . Awesome story!

Bible Believer said...

Thanks to the two posters above....for bringing up more points and your support. I hope this can get young people and others to think.

Anonymous said...

"They will present themselves as relating to you, and being sensitive to "the pain" but it is a way of deception. Same as other things in the world such as some of the false things in psychology and more."

When I read that I thought of the Out of the Shadows Whosoever poster you put up. You have this big demon standing behind the guy. It's like they come on to you saying how they relate to your pain, but they're really a big demon ready to devour you.

Anonymous said...

Dear Bible Believer,

I was looking at one of the sites you like, Liberty to the Captives.

This sentence stood out:

"Those who follow the Lord Jesus Christ abstain from all appearance of evil. They do not mark themselves with symbolism that represents evil."

Bottom line. It's can't be any more clearer than that. Now that makes sense.

They were talking about the Masonic dot in the 0 on the Eight Kingdoms book.

On the whosoevers blog they had a picture with one of their friends. He's a fighter, I think. He had a big O with a dot in the middle in a name on his T-shirt. I'd try to look it up on their blog to be exact, but I cannot look at their blog anymore.

Bible Believer said...

I agree, with the avoiding all appearances of evil.

Definitely there is even more symbolism with the whosoevers, then even pointed out, the circle with a dot in the middle, yes is an occult symbol. It's like they tried to use as many symbols as possible, isn't it....

Anonymous said...

On their blog for march 21, 2012 they promote an artist, Melissa Leslie. She's had a hard life. She says god gave her a vision. It's a painting. This is a vision of a girl on a couch in a red dress. Per The artist's description, the girl's position invites lust. Her ghastly flesh presents an exhausted soul. Her jaded expression exudes coldness. The iris and pupils of her eyes have been surgically removed to aid in her self deception. Her emaciated limbs insinuate unworthy sacrifice. The painting has demons peering behind her and some skeletons.
How can something like this come from God? She throws in Bible verses to help with the description.
This is obviously not from the God of the Bible. The God of the Bible says to stay away from every appearance of evil. And that's all this painting conveys. It reminds me of how music videos sexualize guns and violence. And now we are being subjected to evil being presented as good and rationalized by the Bible verses and references to christ this artist uses. She says the girls red dress represents christ's blood. I also noticed in all of the pictures of Ryan Reis speaking to all those kids he never has a Bible. But then we knew they aren't presenting the Jesus Christ of the Bible anyway. So you come out of a hard life, come to Jesus, and express yourself with evil-looking symbolism? How confusing this must be for the kids looking at this.

Anonymous said...

Read Knowles post over at the Secret Sun:

The Secret Sun: Conspiracy and Control in the American Twilight -

Listen to the podcast.

This article and his need to be put together like 2+2!

BB, I know you posted on his blog way back about their/his reluctance to discuss "real evil".

In the podcast he does lay out the real world nuts and bolts of these groups. Knowles is showing how they influence people. This "music" thing is the 80's (to now) twist.

Is Satan behind it all ultimately? Sure. Who gives the ideas to all these mind control etc. researchers? Somebody with innate knowledge of the human mind and music...the sciences...etc.

I'm glad you and him are both working to reveal the clues. A coherent picture emerges of our predicament.

Bible Believer said...

I went and looked. I am not going to provide links, but it can found using the date. I want to tell my readers avoid it but if you do, be cautious. That is one of the sickest and most Satanic pieces of art work, I have ever seen in my entire life. Even worse it advertises itself as Christian.

I am going to leave the above post up, because I believe the person meant well in warning doing the comment and I probably would have warned too, but this is a painting posted right on the Whosevers blog! I am at a loss at words. This was so evil, I can't even write everything I am thinking here. Tears came to my eyes, thinking about what they are doing to the young people. I will be going to pray after writing this.

That painting shows open MK ultra markings along with the blatant satanic aspects including dozens of demons in various forms behind a very sexily dressed woman on a couch, she is covered but dressed immodestly. The painting has lizards and skeleton babies. They post bible verses saying this painting is full of "Christian symbolism" which is beyond sick. How the neck has been painted as being from "another creature" separating head from body is one of them. I don't need to go into detail about the rest. Yes they want to confuse the kids saying the most evil things represent bible verses.

One thing, seeing this stuff, will leave one with no doubt as to the depths of the spiritual war we are now in.

Ephesians 6

10 Finally, my brethren, be strong in the Lord, and in the power of his might.

11 Put on the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to stand against the wiles of the devil.

12 For we wrestle not against flesh and blood, but against principalities, against powers, against the rulers of the darkness of this world, against spiritual wickedness in high places.

13 Wherefore take unto you the whole armour of God, that ye may be able to withstand in the evil day, and having done all, to stand.

14 Stand therefore, having your loins girt about with truth, and having on the breastplate of righteousness;

15 And your feet shod with the preparation of the gospel of peace;

16 Above all, taking the shield of faith, wherewith ye shall be able to quench all the fiery darts of the wicked.

17 And take the helmet of salvation, and the sword of the Spirit, which is the word of God:

18 Praying always with all prayer and supplication in the Spirit, and watching thereunto with all perseverance and supplication for all saints;

19 And for me, that utterance may be given unto me, that I may open my mouth boldly, to make known the mystery of the gospel,

Bible Believer said...

I went to Knowles blog, kind of on a witness to the unbelievers mission. I'll do that on occasion, I have posted on Catholic blogs, Hard core Quiverful SAHD websites etc, to try and give some truth. I posted on Knowles board for a few weeks and was threatened with a would banning. I knew he did not like what I had to say.

I think he reveals a lot the Jungian stuff is nothing new to me from my UU occult days. He is basically Joseph Campbell with a conspiracy twist for the hipster and hero-comic book set.

He does tell a lot of truths about Dominionism, the use of religion in the NWO, etc.

Years ago God prepared me when I was a newer Christian, I faced those who repeated the lie over and over that the elite invented "Christianity", it was interesting because I already recognized they were all marked for the occult. There are endless websites now that expose conspiracies, and much more but one core component? The denial of Jesus Christ. There is a reason they are all joined together on that game plan. They are all not working hours and day to disprove "shiva" or "allah" of Islam or any other false "gods".

I was on then an old Alex Jones board. I became familiar even later with the masonic-marked to the gills Synchro-Mystics. He is kind of in the Synchro-Mystic camp except with much more comics and pop culture.

Without the Holy Spirit. the full picture is NOT there. He just doesn't know. Is he sincere? I hope so, but the weird sprawled across the face hand gesture has me thinking...Try and make that one by accident..
I'll check that article out, The Hearst angle, with BG is an interesting one.

I am glad you saw my old comments on there.

Bible Believer said...

I wrote things like this....You will find this one interesting. I did end up leaving, he was not happy to have me there nor other followers. Dust of sandals...etc....

"Bible Believer said...

I already know about the antichrist church joining hands with the Communist "christian" church of China. The Pope and other evangelical phonies like Billy Graham have been working on this for decades. It is part of the setting up for the BEAST system and the antichrist church, there is a reason that in communist-state run churches in China, that the book of Revelation is banned from the rewritten and skewed Bibles.

Ever wonder why the Pope and others have called for the United Nations to form a 'new world order" or have called for a global goverance body over economics? Think about it.

They have stretched the net over China as well.

The problem here, is folks here see the beast antichrist [counterfeit christian] system as representing Jesus Christ. It does not.

Also one thing bugs me here, you folks admit evil exsists, and there is grand conspiracies running the planet but then turn around and deny the existence of Satan or Lucifer? How does that work out? I just hope some of you can think on this. By the way I remember being given the lie, by various occultists that the entire Bible was written by the elite, well try and read it, it's not too friendly to them, it speaks of the entire planet being deceived by those who worship Baalim. [Hsa 11]

Its like David Icke who warns about the "luciferian" repetilians who turns around and trys to tell us lucifer isn't real and tries to sell his own version of a New Age religion.

By the way I believe disinformationists expose some 'truths'. Many things they do right in front of people's faces and telling their plans, but they depend on the fact that most of the planet is spiritually blind or deluded. What is odd is some of the websites there too exposing Lady Gaga as a Satanist, etc, while denying the Christian gospel. I find the whole synchro-mystical network very interesting from this perspective too. Why warn of Satan if you don't really believe he exsists?

[the world is in deception and I believe truth lies in Jesus Christ, all the religions, philosophies, Jung--by the way I read his stuff while in the UU, etc will only end you to a dead end]
8:02 PM "

One thing websites like his, he does have a lot of information, like the other controlled opposition ones, we have to be cautious and realize how the information is used.

His emphasis is to tell people to REJECT CHRISTIANITY in total from what I could tell. He is NOT a Christian, himself.

As I said there is layers of deception. He said a few things with truth, yeah a NWO certainly is being built in many places without the UN's help. etc. But always be cautious on websites like that.

well going to go pray now. I don't regret doing the Whosoever article here. One thing to think about this is only ONE band....

Anonymous said...

Yes to all.

Basically, what I'm saying is...if you listen to his podcast..he correctly points out that it's all part of a fake-o "christian" right wing political deal. Very right wing with lots of money behind it.

You have to be intelligent enough to listen to him and not throw out the baby with the bathwater.

He details the using of actual potent, heavily researched mind control techniques in many ministries.

It used to be mainly in "revival" type settings. What you illustrate here is related stuff, just updated and using what's somewhat "cool" at the current moment.

Mainly, beware of actual nuts and bolts human engineering techniques, not just purely spiritual ones. You may fall for one and not the other.

BOTH main political parties in the US are using these techniques heavily. Again, investigate this stuff so you can identify it.

It's much more insidious than what artwork a band uses on a t-shirt or website.

Anonymous said...

Seriously, it's like some kind of brainwashing or mind control to get people to associate satanic imagry with Christ in that painting. Well, just like the Whosoevers are doing - they're doing the same thing. Talk about Christ while inundating you with satanic images and symbols. I think they are just another tool for the NWO in preparation for the anti-christ. False teachings with signs and wonders abound in churches today using contemplative/new age/occult methods. The more people that accept and practice these things, the more easily they will accept the anti-christ when he comes on the scene.

There's so much wrong with that painting. As the Bible says, when you come to Jesus Christ, you are a new creature and all the old things pass away (2 Corinthians 5:17). You cannot serve two masters (Matthew 6:24). We must stay away from every apperance of evil (I Thessalonians 5:22).

Philippians 4:8 says: Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

This is what the Bible instructs us to do. This is what we WANT to do if we are truly following Jesus Christ. The things of this world and it's satanic imagery is repulsive to someone who is walking with Jesus Christ.

Yes, the world is coming under a very strong delusion. I pray every day for God to give me his wisdom, common sense and good judgment, discernment. We need these things desperately these days. Thank you again for your hard work BB.

Anonymous said...

1 Corinthians 10:21. "Ye cannot drink the cup of the Lord and the cup of demons; ye cannot be partakers of the Lord's table and the table of demons. Do we provoke the Lord to jealousy? Are we stronger than he?

All things are lawful for me, but all things are not expedient : all things are lawful for me, but all things edify not"

We can do what we want, but is it wise? Does it edify God or man? Who are you following? We can't have it both ways.

The Bible also says we are children of light, not darkness.

Bible Believer said...

Obviously that is definite mind control and brainwashing, they definitely have SUCCEEDED in heating the frogs up slowly allowing them to ACCEPT things that would have been unacceptable even a few years ago.
The discrepancy is so vast, surely they are using some psychological technique there, in getting people's brains to trip into a cognitive dissonance as it were, and tell themselves to ignore 'their lying eyes" and there you have it, people dumbed down and controlled even further. It's gaslighting on a VAST SCALE enterprise, aren't we seeing in society as a whole, where they are doing things right now in the open but because they say they aren't...people buy it? If one studies how psychopaths [reprobates, wicked etc] operate making sure to screen out for the psychology goobley-gook and realizing biblically that the children of the father of LIE, it puts all the pieces together. We are seeing people being deadened down, and the days warned of in the Bible ARE HERE....

Isaiah 5:12
Woe unto them that call evil good, and good evil; that put darkness for light, and light for darkness; that put bitter for sweet, and sweet for bitter!

You are right they are just one more tool, there are hundreds of groups in various areas like this, no make that thousands perhaps, affecting all areas of life.

and wonders abound in churches today using contemplative/new age/occult methods. The more people that accept and practice these things, the more easily they will accept the anti-christ when he comes on the scene.

There's so much wrong with that painting. As the Bible says, when you come to Jesus Christ, you are a new creature and all the old things pass away (2 Corinthians 5:17). You cannot serve two masters (Matthew 6:24). We must stay away from every apperance of evil (I Thessalonians 5:22).

Philippians 4:8 says: Finally, brethren, whatsoever things are true, whatsoever things are honest, whatsoever things are just, whatsoever things are pure, whatsoever things are lovely, whatsoever things are of good report; if there be any virtue, and if there be any praise, think on these things.

To be frank, no Christian with the Holy Spirit indwelling would take that painting for being Christian, they would be absolutely REPULSED and when that happens it's time to get away.

I prayed yesterday after seeing this, just troubled, and praying for young people to be free and to see through these lies and delusions and that they will be born again and I pray too for the same things you have listed from God. We need His protection and direction. Thanks for your encouragement.

To the other poster thanks for those verses too, definitely appropriate.

Bible Believer said...

correction above, the children of the father of lies, lie....

Sinner said...

I'm pretty sure if christ was on the earth today he would call all of you guys Pharisees. I've got a great Idea stop finding everything wrong with other christians and look at your own lives,when jesus was on the earth you didn't read the bible and say he was with the christians he was with sinners drunkards tax collectors adulterers thieves.ponder on that for a min

Bible Believer said...

Now as you imagine Jesus Christ showing up and seeing the black T-shirts with Pentagrams, and the phrase OBEY, owls, and pictures with demons on them, ask yourself truly what would HE think? God is watching all this stuff NOW and has warned about it. I've been called a Pharisee before, for exposing things that are false, it's really nothing new. Sure Jesus would go talk to the tattoo set and other sinners if He were here on earth today, but He wouldn't be saying "Hey those pentagram tattoos are cool!" Also ask yourself, Does the Bible warn about those who will do anything to deceive you? The answer is YES. And ask yourself what does the Bible say concerning Christians and the things of darkness? They are to flee from them.

Anonymous said...

The Jesus of the Bible rebuked evil. The Whosoevers and friends seem to wallow in it with all the demonic symbolism.

On their blog for Sept 8, a picture is posted by a fan. It's called resurrection, with a skeleton dressed in Whosoever garb arising arout of the mire, it looks like. The t-shirt the skeleton is wearing has a picture of who I assume they are projecting as Jesus with rays coming out from behind his head and a W in a circle. Dear Sinner, this is not the Jesus of the Bible. That is another jesus they are depicting. Baal comes to mind.

I look at that picture, how does that glorify Jesus Christ? It's glorifying someone and it's not Jesus Christ.

Absolutely, Bible Believer - people are accepting things today that would not have been acceptable years ago. It's been a slow indoctrination until it is now right in your face.

Dear Sinner, when you begin to read the Bible you begin to see things as God sees them.

The jesus the Whosoevers are leading you to leads to death - just like all the skeletons and demons advertise all over their site. I pray your eyes will be opened.

Satan, the father of all lies and the ruler of this world wants to keep you from the Jesus Christ of the Bible. That's what the Whosoevers are doing.

Anonymous said...

Jesus also told the drunkards, adulterers, murderers, tax collectors to sin no more.

They left their old life behind if they truely believed in Jesus Christ. They didn't continue to be murderers to reach other murderers (Paul). I don't believe they continued to be aldulterers to reach other adulterers.

We are to avoid every appearance of evil. Using the appearance of evil is the only way to attract the tattoo crowd?

Ryan Reis didn't want to leave his old life behind.

Just like Bible Believer said, Jesus didn't use evil symbolism to attract sinners. He just told them the truth!

It seems people don't want the truth these days. They want a christ who says you can do what you want - I saved you!

But read Romans 6

What they don't realize is that if you truely trust Christ, you want to read the Bible and get to know Him, you are a new creature, the old is gone. And people can tell by your actions and speech. What is in the heart comes out in your speech. Matthew 15:18
The fruit of the spirit is evident Galatians 5:22-23

As a true believer you don't want anything to do with the appearance of evil, let along project it yourself!

Anonymous said...

So, I can just picture the Whosoevers sitting around asking, "As a Christian band who glorifies Jesus, what kind of images should we project"?

Well, let's see.... we could use serpents, inverted pentagrams, skeletons, masonic and luciferian symbolism like the eye in the pyramid, we can even put the one eye on our t-shirts and say "and the blind will see" (but only out of one eye?), put a circle around a W and make it red to go with the black and grey website, in pictures we can flash the devils horns and point up - just a couple hand sign examples, and we can promote artists on our blog who use lots of leering/sneering skeletons and demons, oh, and we should use a Nazi-looking eagle and lightening bolts, too! Hmmm, and the people modelng our shirts, lets have them look hard and angry, like they are about to punch you out! yeah.

As a Bible believer who is called to use discernment and test all things - I will point out to all who will listen to me that there is something wrong with that.

By the way. I don't believe that they are Christians.

Anonymous said...

We are not to become like the world to reach the world. God says that to be in the world is to have enmity with him. We are to be separate from the world. The whosoevers bring people to the world, not Jesus Christ.

Anonymous said...

Jesus reached out to sinners but he didn't become like them to reach them.

Anonymous said...

You have ALL been lead astray by the Dark Angel. Have fun in Hell, harlots.

Marvin said...

You think you guys have got it so figured out with your "religion". Jesus is love. Jesus came to save the world, not condemn it. Try to see past your "taught" way of how to believe in Christ to see who Christ really is. Honestly reading this blog post and comments has made me ashamed of how condemning and prideful the attitudes of most Christians. You sound like a bunch of Pharisees who think they know it all and that there us no other way to reach the list than what you've been taught in a seminary. See past that stuff and spread the GOOD news. Gods message isn't to judge how others live or how they need to act in order for God to save them. That's the wrong message. We are not to judge. That's for God to do. We just need to love our neighbor and spread the good news.

Bible Believer said...

I was never taught in a seminary, they would have thrown me out for believing the Bible.

What is LOVING about occult symbols and hand signs? For the kids who these guys are fooling who simply DO NOT KNOW, its more LOVING to warn them to get away!

Actually Christians are supposed to "judge", if you can't even judge what is good or evil, what use are you? You are open to any of the devils deceptions.

1 Cor 6:2

Do ye not know that the saints shall judge the world? and if the world shall be judged by you, are ye unworthy to judge the smallest matters?

Anonymous said...

God is love, but he also hates evil. Proverbs 8:13

When I see people covering themselves in demonic images and occult symbolism, to think that they are leading you to the true Jesus Christ is pure deception.

The bible is full of warnings about false teachers - and they are everywhere these days.

Jeremiah 5:30. It seems people prefer false teaching over the Bible

My taught way to learn about Jesus is from the Bible. I believe what the Bible says, not what men teach. A wonderful thing about studying the Bible and allowing the Holy Spirit to lead you - you will have the mind of Christ and understand what God is telling us in the Bible. Please read 1 Corinthians 2.

When you surrender your life to Jesus Christ and read his word, there is a transformation. Your thoughts, attitudes, priorities, and subsequently, your actions change. It also says this will happen in the Bible.

Jesus is love, but he says if you love him you will read his word and obey his commandments. You don't just say I believe but still live in the world. The Bible says you cannot sit at the table of the Lord and the table of demons at the same time.

God wants us to read the Bible for many reasons. One reason is to have discernment. The Bible tells us that when you are in the world, without the spirit of God, the Bible is foolishness.

Bible Believer is right on. The loving thing to do is warn about the dangers, not take you to it.

Why do whosoever fans think all they have to do is say I believe in Jesus and that's it? The bible says the demons believe in Jesus.

Kirby Harris said...

Bible Believer, not sure if you know this or if anyone mentioned this to you, but The Whosoevers is not a band, its a ministry.

If you don't want to look silly you need to change your blog to mention that they are a ministry not a band.

Anonymous said...

The new age movement is waiting for their christ, the Lord Maitreya, the anointed one, to appear. When he comes on the world scene will the Whosoevers warn that this is not Jesus Christ, or will they welcome him and encourage their followers to do so as well?

Anonymous said...

Dear Marvin,

There's something that happens to a Christian that it seems many who profess Jesus Christ don't realize.

As you develop your relationship with Jesus Christ, pray, read the Bible, surrender to Him and trust Him, you begin to change.

One of those changes is that the appearance of evil is very repulsive. To a Bible believer who loves Jesus Christ, to see professing Christians display demons, skeletons, occult symbols,devils horn hand sign, etc., is very alarming. It's very upsetting. There's something very wrong with that picture.

You seem to love Jesus and be very grateful that he loves you so much. I pray that you get into his Word and grow and mature as a Christian. You will understand what I'm talking about. The Bible tells us that as we mature we develop the mind of Christ - you will see things differently.

It's so sad that Kirby will pick out such a small thing as to calling them a band or a ministry. What does it matter when the bottom line is kids as well as adults are being so deceived?

Bible Believer said...

Thank you for your post ANON, I totally agree.

Anonymous said...

I found out about The Whosoevers when in 2009. I went to the event to hear Brian "Head" Welch's testimony, because I was very skeptical. After hearing his testimony, along with a few others, I was in awe. The fact that people were coming to know the Lord just by hearing stories about how God was working in someone's life blew me away. There were so many people who accepted Christ and it made me so happy. I can understand if you don't like the skulls or some of the images, but I can assure you that The Whosoevers are not Satanic by any means. I have spoken with these people personally and they are so on fire for God, more so than most. In the same way that you can't judge a book by it's cover, you cannot and should not judge others by what they or their website looks like. Remember what Jesus said in Matthew 7. We will all be judged by the same standard we judge others by.

Anonymous said...

The Whosoevers are reaching the gay community and people you would be scared to make eye contact with. They love them and disciple them , also get them plugged into there Friday night study. You guys should check it out, It's live 7:30pm every Friday.

They love Jesus with all there heart, mind, soul, strength and judge no one.

Stevo- said...

I rebuke you in the NAME of Jesus Christ~! These guys are doing two things that you are not... 1! Loving people where they are...2! reaching people that YOU wont even have anything to do with... why?? because of how they dress or act. Jesus wants us to love one another! How dare you say these things! Screw your man made doctrines and love as Christ LOVED!

Anonymous said...

HAHAHA you all are grasping at "signs" and "symbols" and trying to connect them to Satanic symbols. Grow up and get a life.

Anonymous said...

You are what the Bible calls a busy body. Stop trying to ruin the fine ministries these guys have. You could do better by using your your excellent writing skills to further the kingdom of God. Not to tear it down. Satan has possession of you and turn from your sins while you can.

RM Hoffman said...

Seriously? You are blind and you are using a twisted theology. I suggest you in enroll in seminary and truly study theology as I have. Next thing I know you are going to say that my iMac is of the devil because because it has an apple with a bite taken out of it symbolize the serpent who deceived Adam and Eve. It's false and ridiculous as is your post. This is an area Paul warned about. We should not be so picky on things that do not matter in the long run. My God have mercy on you as you are false teaching.

Anonymous said...

You people (those who published this) sicken me. You're so ignorant, it's not even funny. It's just completely pathetic and makes me lose faith in humanity. Stop calling yourselves Christians until you've truly found Jesus and actually know what you're talking about. Because, right now, you're complete idiots only hating on a genre of music you personally don't like, but in reality is used by God everyday. Grow up, you morons.

Whosoever_777 said...

ARE YOU SERIOUS!?!? If the Whosoevers are so 'satanic', then why do they praise the name of Jesus Christ? Why do ALL of the Whosoevers have a testimony and openly share it? Do your research on other sites that AREN'T

wade said...

It's a shame that you have no idea what you're talking about. Good job at trying to turn people AWAY from Christ. You're more of a problem for Christians than anything the world has to offer.

Anonymous said...

Wow this is rather judgemental and ignorant. Anyone ever hear the verse from 1 Samuel 16:7? "Man looks at the outward appearance but the Lord looks at the heart."

Anonymous said...

While "The Whosoevers" are out bringing Jesus to the lost and broken to Christ, you are sitting at home, writing a biased, uneducated post against them. And, since you have it set so apposing views will not be sent out, I hope you have fun in your bubble. Your Christian pride is going to drag you to hell. I love P.O.D, Flyleaf and Brain's music. It is all bible based. You however, are a thorn bringing discord within the body of Christ.

Anonymous said...

omg are you serious? These dudes are not a satanic cult get real. Smh you should be ashamed of yourselves! Christians judging Christians you should check yourself first cuzzo. Ridiculous. People like you are what make others run away from Jesus. You owe Brian, Sonny, Ryan and the whole whosoever movement and every follower of Christ an apology for that accusation homie. God sure do need it

Anonymous said...

Your bagging and talking bad of other Christians including Christian Bands is nothing but witch craft, why are you not spending this time spreading the Gospel of the Kingdom of God and Jesus Christ instead. The bible (word of God) teaches us to support the body of Christ not tearing it down I rebuke your witch craft in Jesus Name.

Therefore do not let your good be spoken of as evil; for the kingdom of God is not eating and drinking, but righteousness and peace and joy in the Holy Spirit. For he who serves Christ in these things is acceptable to God and approved by men. Therefore let us pursue the things which make for peace and the things by which one may edify another.
(Rom 14:16-19 NKJV)

Anonymous said...

hmmmm again with the Christians and the music. here is something to wrap your one track minds around: does any of you know what kind of angel lucifer was before he was cast out of heaven and sent to hell? HE WAS THE ANGEL OF MUSIC! and who gave him the ability to be the angel of music??????? that could only be GOD! SO NOW THAT WE KNOW WERE ALL MUSIC COMES FROM LETS BREAK THIS DOWN A BIT, if God wanted Lucifer to be the angel of music it must have been part of his greater plan. He must have known he was going to cast out Lucifer and send him to hell! he must have known that he was going to keep his musical abilities! he must have known that Lucifer was going to make, rock n roll, heavy metal, and every other type of music that Christians point the finger of blame at!!!!(even though that is a sin) All music comes from God!!! the message might not be correct but the music is still Gods work! it came from him and it was part of his greater plan!!!! open your eyes and realize that and find something more christian like to do like looking into yourself and correcting your faults that God wouldnt like! perfect example: pointing the finger of blame!!!!!

Randall said...

As a Christian, I am deeply troubled by all the judging going on towards the Whosoevers. How is what they're doing any different from a standard church testimonial? I saw Head just this past Saturday in San Antonio, and his testimony was just as good then as it was when I read about it seven years ago.

And whoever mentioned "new age" religions: they're older than Christianity is. As far as the world goes, Christianity is a new age religion, older than only maybe Mormonism and Scientology.

It's just...people who judge others, especially those that are supposed to be brothers and sisters, make me sick and scared to be a Christian. Christ would never have done this, so why would you?

And before I go, Korn is "secular demonic music". Look up the term and listen to the music before you go throwing it around like you know what you're talking about.

Anonymous said...

this stuff makes me laugh. the fact is, i have never been closer to God than when i was at a P.O.D. concert. you christians wanna sit in pews and not reachout to the world like Christ commanded and then call people who do Satanic? fine, you will be judged, but i for one support the whosoevers and the numerous lives they have changed. you say they are satanic, but the only proof you have is that their tshirt designs scare you... listen to their sermons, listen to their music, you will see how wrong you are. the fact is, all their lyrics are about God, Murder your flesh talks about killing your desires and replacing them with Gods, and I must say i think it is foolish to try to shoot down Christians just because you dont like the way they look. why dont we band together as Christians instead of calling eachother satanic? wake up.

Contessa Thayer said...


Anonymous said...


It's easy to point out the things that are on the surface, symbols, tradition, etc. I think the Pharisees did the same thing to Jesus Himself, about traditions, and calling Him blasphemous. Last I heard, many of these guys you are judging are humanitarians, giving most, if not all their fortune to promote the Word of God and Jesus Christ.

What was the last thing you did for Jesus?

Paul said...

O fortunately, all of this article and thought is from you, not from God. Because my God doesn't care about external features, logos or symbols: "But the Lord said to Samuel, "Do not consider his appearance or his height, for I have rejected him. The Lord does not look at the things man looks at. Man looks at the outward appearance, but the Lord looks at the heart." (1 Samuel 16:7 NIVUK)
You seem to be a fancy religious like the Pharisees don't you? P.O.D. , Brian Head Welch, TobyMac, the Whosoevers or also Impending Doom, Deuteronomium, Antestor, Living Sacrifice and many more are those kind of bands that helped me run away from secular metal music and embrace God. They helped me to take courage, to keep my eyes fixed on The Lord and they made me learn that modern Christian music is healthy for souls, especially for teens. Do you prefer to loose them on KoRn, Marylin Manson or Slipknot holes?
At least, man, you should shut your mouth and think for a while: "Not many of you should presume to be teachers, my brothers, because you know that we who teach will be judged more strictly. (James 3:1 NIVUK)"
Your teachings are selfish, and they are based on hypothesis and supposition. More, you don't even care about those people, we clearly can see, it's so obvious you don't love them even with God's Love!!!
Stop it. Go and talk to them. I will pray for you. I hope that you'll find a counsellor and a psychologist, because you seem to really need one.
And, last words, give up judging people. God will do it in the end. Meanwhile, try and learn to love the way Jesus love them. ""For God so loved the world that he gave his one and only Son, that whoever believes in him shall not perish but have eternal life. For God did not send his Son into the world to condemn the world, but to save the world through him. (John 3:16, 17 NIVUK)"


Anonymous said...

You people need help. God is moving in huge ways through a community that most of you would probably run screaming out of to your safe sofas and love seats. Anyone can take an image and spin it to what they want it to mean. I'm a christian in a metal band that has gone into the dark places and witnessed to the hurting people that would never come to your church because they don't want to be treated like crap by you. Jesus walked amongst the sinners, not with the converted. How about you "Go ye into the world" and stop tearing down your brothers and sisters who are already out there doing it. The biggest problem with Christianity is the judgmental, self righteous members within. Do me a favor. If you can't contribute to the cause then stay silent so you don't scare away someone that I hope to bring to God.

Anonymous said...

The person who wrote this article is stupid. POD have brought more people to Jesus (count me as well) then you ever will. Unlike you, they don't judge others either. POD has a song on their new record called "Babylon is a Murderer" which the entire song is taken straight out of the book of Jeremiah. What about those lyrics??? Christians can be other Christians worst enemies. Smarten up and love Jesus as one. There are REAL satanist out there, pick on them instead of people that have spent there whole lives devoted and preaching Gods word. Sonny in POD actively prays to Jesus during their shows. What hole are you living in?!?!!

Anonymous said...

YOU ARE MISSING SOMETHING : Speak the TRUTH in LOVE!!!! These people who have such amazing testimonies are reaching many who would otherwise never be reached by a buttoned-up, Phariseeical judgemental person such as yourself. DO YOU REALIZE YOU ARE HINDERING CHRIST'S MESSAGE THROUGH THESE INSTRUMENTS THAT GOD IS USING?? What are you doing to spread Christ's love and message? Do you think the people who listen to this music and could come to Christ because of their testimony would ever listen to you? I doubt it. You must, then, think all those people are not worthy to be saved. Who else will reach them?? All you do is serve to prove to doubters that all Christians are terribly judgemental. And you continue to give all of us who love Jesus a bad name. You disgust me. You should be ashamed of yourself. Judge not, lest you be judged BY YOUR OWN METER.

Anonymous said...

A lot of you seem very content to bash on pastors and their kids... Didn't people that did that in the bible suffer some sort of tragedy for speaking ill of God's anointed? If you truly believe they're wrong in what they're doing then pray that God may change them or change you; either way, God's gonna change someone. I been listening to Christian metal for years and I can honestly say that I use some it to enter into Jesus Christ's presence and let me tell you, his presence indeed comes down. Stop being so judgmental and pray for change in the singers life or yours. May God bless you all :D

bob said...

This whole article has made me laugh. I appreciate that people are concerned, but i've seen Brian Welch in concert, and many other christian rock and metal bands, and they proclaimed Jesus more strongly and more effectively than at alot of churches i've been to. Look at lyrics by Demon Hunter, Disciple, even As I Lay Dying, and you can see Jesus and the Christian walk displayed there. Disciple even promotes Compassion International at their shows. You should try researching a band more than just their artwork before you write an article like this, read their lyrics, testimonies and interviews, these are people who love God and serve Him with their gifts, music.

Anonymous said...

I believe these people such as the author and many commenters here who rebuke a style of music they personally don't like are more under the influence of Satan than any Christian band has ever been.

Anonymous said...

You are SO misinformed!!! If you did any real research at all on "The Whosoevers" you wouldn't be on your soap box. They are reaching people YOU wouldn't go near, they are doing Jesus' works among the sinners!!! What are you doing?? You're pointing out the plank in their eyes when you should be taking care of the one in yours. All of this satanic rap is unbelieveable!!! I think you should do your homework.....Lacey who is formally from the band "Flyleaf" is an Athiest who found Jesus and has been singing about Him for 10 years. Jut cause it's not what you're use to, isn't always what someone else i use to. All you're doing is helping Satan on his quest to stop The Whosoevers. Watch their Friday night's ALL ABOUT JESUS!!! people like you are why it's so hard to get peoplpe to see the real's all about LOVE and you "Good Christians" are just spreading the hate.

Anonymous said...

This legalized thinking is exactly what Jesus came to save us from. What is a Christian supposed to look like? Do you think we're going to reach the young people of today by playing Jimmy Swaggert albums?

This is about souls and I am not sure I understand what "false Christianity" is.

We are in a battle and we need all of God's soldiers to stand up not just the ones who appear on the cover of your church's membership guide.

I say this with love, but I admonish you to reconsider your thoughts on these brothers. They are actively pursuing a life of righteousness and reaching scores of people who would never listen to traditional speakers of the gospel.

I am sure your intentions were good, but you're simply wrong this time. Love one another brother and support all that is holy and filled by the spirit even if it does not fit your label of what a Christian should be

Anonymous said...

You sheeple will believe anything a random fanatic types on the internet LOL-Too bad none of the ppl you are referencing are here to defend themselves.. I know some of these folks you talk about...and this suggestion you offer is utterly ridiculous and you should repent for judging them.

Anonymous said...

Thank you Marvin!

Anonymous said...

Matthew 7:1 "Judge no one, for you to will be judged" I have never seen so many people on fire for the lord that are reaching out to the people who are suffering the most in the world. THE YOUTH. Ryan isn't afraid to use different types of music to grab they're attention such as metal, hip hop, reggae etc. All of their music has a message about Jesus. Jesus doesn't care what kind of music you use, as long as it praises him it could be metal.I understand that people associate metal with "the devil". But when its used for Jesus then there is nothing wrong with it. The whosovers talk about the REAL problems that most churches won't ever touch. Jesus hung out with the scum of the earth, such as prostitutes, tax collectors, etc. I'm sorry, but not everyone is going to look "holy" to project an image of Christianity. They are wonderful people on fire for Jesus! In the end thats all that matters!

Anonymous said...

This is pathetic. Your article has many flaws. First of all, Heavy Music is not evil, how can adding distortion to a guitar make it evil. Only the lyrics can be. And let me tell you. you obviously are so blind that you can not understand lyrics. All these bands are Christian and are not trying to sugarcoat it all to make it all pretty. They are singing about the reality of many people that have not had the chance to understand the love of God. It is people like you that make no one want to become a Christian or even consider it. The Second point is the fact that all those symbols dont mean anything... Oooo they have artwork with an owl on it. It is so sad that you go in and nit pick at all the individual shapes that form an image. All these bands are a lot more likely and already do make a bigger difference in this world then you people could ever do. They show love to those that need it. Plus they have good messages, and make awesome music. So why dont you stop being religious freaks and learn what true Christianity is. It is a relationship with Jesus and not a religion. Or rather you can stay in your religious circle and waste away your lives by following man made rules and being slaves to them. Or you can open your hearts and let the real God of this universe in and change your lives.

Anonymous said...

As a Whosoever, I'm praying for all those who read this blog and the writer of this blog as well. Jesus knows my heart, Brian "Head" Welch's heart, Sonny's heart, Ronnie's heart, Ryan's heart, and Lacey's heart. I heard about The Whosoevers when I was going through a difficult time in my life, hearing the testimony of those who are involved in this ministry,(not a band, like stated) has changed my life for the better. My walk with God is stronger than it has ever been. My relationship with my family is stronger because of my renewed faith. The youth being reached and learning about God is so amazing and growing rapidly because of this amazing ministry that is the Whosoevers. I know that not everyone will understand the music or appreciate the music but should take some time for yourselves to hear a Whosoever Friday night service with an open heart and mind and see what God is doing in this ministry to reach the lost youth of America.

Here is a link for Whosoevers Friday Nights

You have heard that it was said, You shall love your neighbor and hate your enemy;But I tell you, Love your enemies and pray for those who persecute you,To show that you are the children of your Father Who is in heaven; for He makes His sun rise on the wicked and on the good, and makes the rain fall upon the upright and the wrongdoers [alike]. For if you love those who love you, what reward can you have? Do not even the tax collectors do that? And if you greet only your brethren, what more than others are you doing? Do not even the Gentiles (the heathen) do that? You, therefore, must be perfect [growing into complete maturity of godliness in mind and character, having reached the proper height of virtue and integrity], as your heavenly Father is perfect. Matthew 5:43-48 AMP

Anonymous said...

"put a circle around a W and make it red to go with the black and grey website" You make me LOL so hard! This site you are looking at while reading this text is black and grey!!!!!!

Anonymous said...

Bible Believer,

I understand why you may be skeptical about what they do, about what they say and the testimony they give. But you really should read the book written by Brian "Head" Welch, for it is a message of the love that god can give to anyone. the symbols are just what they are, symbols.

But the words they use are not for deceiving, they are a powerful truth about what god can change in people. For an external eye it may not look that way (and the symbols are not helping i will admit that) but it is by no mean a satanic movement hiding in the shadows.

I do believe that what they are doing, is another way to find god. One that do not fit you and me (i found god a long time ago) but fits a lot of people who do not fit anywhere else and are constantly left behind.

And that is a good thing.

Andrew Saunders said...

You guys point out stuff and turn it around. You havent even heard any of these artist speak. All of the mentioned bands i listen to and yes, they do sing about jesus. If you would listen and think, youd see they sing about jesus. Stop trying to falsely accuse. Your doing morfe harm than satan himself.

Anonymous said...

Well, Head was kind enough to share the link to your blog with everyone. Judge not lest you be judged. God Bless you all and may the Lord open your eyes.

Ray said...

John 13:34

Brittany said...

This is complete and utter nonsense. I am a supporter of The Whosoevers and everyone involved. I've listened to them all speak and they love God with all there hearts. Brian and Ryan both used to be into drugs and all that but they changed there life around and MURDER YOUR FLESH is exactly what the bible says"deny the flesh" but The Whosoevers jsut changed the wording slightly,whocares! They are reaching teens & young people who need God. Trust me if I thought they were "full of it" or worshipping Satan I wouldnt be apart of it. Look into what they are really about before you go and judge.

Ray said...

john 13:34

I disagree with every word of this post and i feel like it seperates people rather than bringing them together. Jesus' last prayer was for unity...don't forget that. If they dont worship like you and your fans do, does that make them wrong? C'mon, we have to be bigger than this. Love!

Anonymous said...

This blog is an absolute joke, you are the reason why Christianity is mocked, because of blind ignorance to change & a overly judgmental outlook on all things not part of your immediate bible study. Ask yourself, are the Whosoevers not bringing glory to Christ more so than someone who writes a blog to condemn it? Pitty.

Anonymous said...

Wow! I feel bad for the person who wrote this article. You need a revelation of grace and the finished works of the cross...peep some John Crowder or something. Gotta go, Gotta ROCK OUT TO SOME HEAVY METAL!!!! PS: I love Jesus and Jesus loves me and he also loves METAL.

Anonymous said...

I had no idea who the Whosoevers were. Thanks to those of you who railed against them on this site; I have a new band to listen to who grates against the Pharisees and Teachers of Religious Law that inhabit this place. Jesus’ message of heart, faith, and "the least of these" seems to fall on the same sort of deaf ears and hardened hearts of "christians" as it did with the Hebrew religious establishment that tried to suppress him.

Jesus was not a white American prude who listened to Sandi Patti. He dared to say that he was the Son of God while spending his time with whores, tax collectors, and children.

In the end, if you're one of those who would throw a stone at this type of music and those who would listen to it, ask yourself where is your heart? If it is focused on the "sin" of the culture that enjoys heavy bass, iambic pentameter, distorted guitar, and mascara; and not the heart of Christ that is empathetic to human suffering, you have your priorities mixed-up and you're message is irrelevant. You can have all of the spiritual gifts, but if you don't have love, they are all worthless.

Anonymous said...

C.S. Lewis wrote a book entirely about demons. I guess he was a member of the occult as well.

Anonymous said...

I cannot believe what I am reading... Jesus saved everyone from The Whosoevers. Their love and passion for Jesus ir just amazing and can`t you see how God is using them in a amazing way ? It doesn`t care what genre of music they are playing, if they are doing it for Jesus Christ and putting their heart and soul in it, the love reaches others. We all are different and we like different things, you can`t just go around and tell, hey they are satanic if you don`t even know them, pray my friends so that God would show you or even to me the truth.

God bless you all.

Sarah Michelle Anderson said...

I think that instead of claiming that these brothers and sisters in Christ are "satanic" or "occult", we need to realize that they are reaching many people that many of us would never come into contact with because we get very self-righteous. We cannot expect the sinners to just come into the church when they do not realize they have sinned! We have to reach out to them, and lay aside every encumbrance. These brothers and sisters are doing just that. About the "murder your flesh" comment, if we are scared by this or think it is anti-Christian, the verse Galatians 5:24 is pretty clear about that. Over and over again the Bible says to "deny self," "die to self," "crucify the flesh," "die daily," and on and on. So that is straight out of the Bible. If we do not murder our flesh, we are simply living in dead religion and not actually experiencing the best of what Jesus has for us.

Brian Smith said...

So many people here are misguided themselves or simply fools. Pay attention, their music has incredible lyrics. That DO glorify God. The song Adonai by Brian Head Welch, Korn's old guitarist, literally means God. Here are some lyrics.

Make your escape from life with Adonai
Everything in life depends on Adonai
Lift all your worries up to Adonai
You will all stop hurting; come to Adonai

Leave me alone now
I'm not from here
My home's in Heaven
Leave me alone

Rise, rise, rise up, Adonai

Adonai means God. You can't get much more straightforward about it than this. These bands do glorify God, but you people seem to be too jaded against the musical genre to realize this.

And before you bring the song Die Religion Die into the mix, here are some lyrics.

Die Religion Die - Brian Head Welch
I'm sick of all your rules
They're so man made
You treat them all like fools
You put My name to shame
I'm everything you're not
I give them love
My ways you have forgot
You put yourselves above

My church is not inside
You're building walls
On Sundays you all hide
While the world just falls
Now go into the world
And destroy Hell

He is talking about all the Christian churches that make up their own rules and laws that have no grounds or precedence in the Bible. They make things up and trick people. It says that we need to cast these false things down and not follow religion, but follow Christ and God.
Also, it refers to the Christians who hide inside the bubble of their church. They go to church, but don't put it to use. Once they leave, it was like they were never there. They hide there. They don't truly follow, they're just fans.

Your Love (Keeps me Alive) - Skillet
Because Your love is better than life
Because Your voice heals me inside
Because my soul is satisfied
Because Your love keeps me alive

I cannot be silent, I­m crying out
My soul is cold, my heart is numb
I break from my old self and step into You

You complete what was never enough
Because Your love is better than life
Because Your voice heals me inside
Because my soul is satisfied
Because Your love keeps me alive

Who's love? Jesus'

All Around Me - Flyleaf
I can feel you all around me
Thickening the air I'm breathing
Holding on to what I'm feeling
Savoring this heart that's healing

My hands float up above me
And you whisper you love me
And I begin to fade
Into our secret place

She's talking about how God saved her.

Seriously people, how is it so hard for you to realize this and break down those jaded walls you have put up around yourselves? These bands reach out to a very large demographic of people, not just the youth, that otherwise would never have come to Jesus. I have a good friend who got saved and baptized by one of these bands. Their name is For Today. If it hadn't been for them when he went to one of their concerts, he would still be that hardcore atheist he was just a few months ago. This is his favorite song.

Devastator - For Today
Let my name be feared at the gates of hell, as I exalt the Savior.
The One that died to buy my victory, and gave me a new name.
Let my name be feared at the gates of hell, as I exalt the Savior.
In the name of the Holy One of God,
I will cast you down at the foot of the cross He hung from.
I will stand behind my Savior, as He burns your kingdom down.
And I will see you on your knees before the King of Kings.
You will lose your throne to the chosen ones. The chosen ones will rise.

Come on people. It straight up says the song is about God. It's about casting down the Devil, not glorifying him. Open your eyes. We can't have people like this destroying what remains of God's nation on this planet. One day, we will all join him, but we want to bring as many people as possible with us, and this music is doing just that. Don't misjudge it. It has saved many of my friends.

Anonymous said...

Simply, you all need to stop discussing all of this as if you yourselves are perfect. I think you all need to read Romans 3 over and over, especially verse 13. Also, for the person blindly insulting Impending Doom: I saw them perform live and honestly even I didn't expect to see it but the lead singer gave a message to the crowd. And not some story only focusing on Him but Jesus Christ's redeeming blood and how God called the band to speak directly to kids who wouldn't be caught dead near a church or listening to any worship music. And nonetheless this band and others were performing at a BAR due to concert location changes, and still proudly spoke and performed songs about Christ. The Holy Spirit moved within that show and people were saved because those bands boldly stepped forward in faith when they could have easily backed down and cancelled the show. So why don't you get to know these bands deeper rather than judging them so quickly while sitting comfortably in your pews, hypocrites? I pray Christ opens your eyes and lets you know how lukewarm you have become.

Anonymous said...

Can you gie me a rundown on how terrible this and is because of the "sound" of their music, please? They praise Jesus on every song in the lyrics but the sound may be of the devil...and in one song he speaks of a different language going through his mind like a flood (the Holy Spirit)... but they have tattoos and used to do drugs so they must be deceivers... Here's the link:

Nathan sikaudio said...

" I have to admit, this stuff is so dark, even choosing to do this article was tough. "
Wha!!?? he is talking about " ymbols". why is it " tough"? what do you have to fear?

the most used phrase all through the bible is "fear not" should be right mate - shouldn't you?

here's my 3 cents worth - this is ridiculous. what do these fundamentalists have to gain from this dribble?

all they have to do is listen to the Whosoever's words, song lyrics of Head or POD or any of their testimonies.
seriously - " symbols"!! yo is tripping mr man! have you sat with any....ANY of these men and asked them what
who God is to them? Jesus means to them? what they have been through to get to where they are today - saved.

John 8:1-11 - check it out.

curious - how many people have you bought to the good word of God & how many have you helped,
through your writings like this? how many have the WHOSOEVERS brought...?

pretty simple really.

i have seen kids, youth, adults be brought to Gods word and know who Jesus is- and only through these bands
and their words, testimonies and scripture they share have these people come to be interested in it. its bought them to church,
youth clubs, they pick up the bible - then stop doing drugs, alcohol...etc.
again, what has this random rant on this blog done for ANY of these kids that need God's word?

what is written here - i see no point to it at all. its judgmental and in no way helping Gods word
( this is more powerful then any cult or symbols) get out there in any way possible.
modern or ancient. if JC was here walking the earth today...i'm sure you'd be surprised of all the way's and places
and social media He and His disciples would use. probably even the Whoseover's stage. (shock horror!)

keep doing exactly what your are doing Head and the Whosever team.

Anonymous said...

I dont normally rant but this seemingly one sided feed needs it...I belive in the one true living god,the holy spirit, and christ as my saviour.Bottom line.I am a father,I am a companion,I work hard and I am also a musician.However I have been a sinner just like ALL of YOU.(including the uber zealous ones who "think"they are squeky clean.YOU ARE NOT).There was once a time when I did different drugs,especially marijuana.Ive lied and lusted like any other man.My struggle with god in my life has been so far a lifelong accurence.Even when I know im wrong I fear god.I would not have this fear should he not be real.I know in my soul he is there.I dont nessecarily need a Pastor,priest,minister etc to tell me that.I even believe the wages of sin is death,WITHOUT the input of ravenous dogs.Let me explain....If you children of god intend to spread gods message,intend to show the world that he lives in all of us and loves all of us and that sins may be forgiven by repentance...then WHY is it that most of the campaining I see almost ALWAYS driven by fear tactics?I cant tellyou how many of these comments I just read and some of it was down right bigoted,spiteful and selfish accusations of a group of thousands of ppl YOU DONT KNOW.Some of you are concerned with some symbols etc that "looks like the rings of saturn"(snarky tone of voice).WHAT,DOES,IT,MATTER?God CREATED ALL! the earth the heavens and EVEN saturn.As much as pagans or whatever stupid cult would like to think it has some signifigance over gods children IT DOES NOT.This isnot a direct attack on christians this is me saying aloud many of you are so distorted with what YOU think god wants for us that you prevent alot of ppl from wanting to get to know him without your help.I dont listen to korn, I dont even listen to brians music,but when I saw him leave secular stages to find god,kick the drugs and start trying to be a better person thru christ, I dont care who you are thats inspiring.Who are any of you to say that the way these ppl get to know the lord is the wrong way?Thats like a catholic saying god doesnt thrive in a baptist and visa versa.Its wrong In so many ways you should be ashamed of yourselves.Jesus Is the bread of life and an offering of peace to mankind.I really wish some of you wouldnt go around preaching his wrath to someone before they understand his love........If anyone wants to give me further input you can contact me at* *I am always willing to speak to someone who does not have to deliver the gloom and doom of the lord.......Praise god and all who seek him to no end

JesusWashedMe said...

Instead of condemning these brothers and sisters in Christ as "occult" or "satanic" we need to realize that what they say is true. They preach the gospel and we should be supporting that! The whole thing about "murder you flesh" being quote "scary" or whatever, we must remember the verse Galatians 5:24. It is very clear. Over and over the Bible says different variations: "Deny self," "die to self," CRUCIFY the FLESH." It's pretty clear that if you DO NOT murder your flesh, that you cannot follow Him. We must not judge on illuminati-type conspiracy theories, (and appearance of the members) when the words coming out of their mouths are straight out of the Word.

Anonymous said...

Sonny from P.O.D. has been slung through all kinds of mud, you ever stop and think that maybe people like youurself cause them to stumble rather than help them to be built up in Christ? They are people too, they have had their share of hardships and all youre doing is tearing them down. Maybe you should encourage them if you think you're wrong in what their doing.

The Redhead said...

You forget that the world doesn't have the same definition of dark and light that you have. There are people that have been enslaved in drugs and prostitution and abuse for their entire lives, and never grew up with the truth or knew who Jesus was, before The Whosoevers stepped up. People need to hear other people who have been through what they've experienced say that Jesus rescued them from their sin and how they came to believe in what the Bible says. Their core message is "that WHOSOEVER believes in [Christ] shall not perish but have everlasting life." Sound familiar?

The problem is you've used full judgement on one part of these people's lives. You've ignored the majority of work that they've done in the public eye, and there's plenty of information and stories on the Internet to show that they do their best to step into the world as a light of truth for Christ. Don't be like the world, to condemn someone's life solely on one action. Jesus didn't do that.

I'd encourage you to look deeper instead of on the surface before you write something like this again. This kind of stuff is what pushes people that honestly live for Christ, and then feel betrayed when another person calling themselves Christian condemn something as satanic that is not. Do better research and spend more time letting God reveal more to you before you reject someone for what it's not trying to be.

Gregg Hart said...

As someone who disagrees with this article whole heartedly, it saddens me even more to see people from the opposing side retaliate with the same type biased and mean spirited comments.

Anonymous said...

*verse 3 of Romans 3

Anonymous said...

I honestly think you all reading way too much into this. So what, you don't understand the way they worship but that doesn't me man you should judge them, make false accusations, and belittle their testimony. The use of symbolism can only be interpreted by the people who imply it. The cross was actually a symbol of death and agony before Jesus was ever associated with it but now we see it in a positive light. Besides, I'm sure if I pushed the envelope enough I could find something "satanic" or unholy about your life.

JB said...

SO many inaccuracies in this article, it is funny. Let's start off with photographic evidence. I shot POD in San Diego, this summer. Sonny wore an "I LOVE JESUS CHRIST" tshirt, as one of the headliners of a major radio station festival: When a kid in the mosh pit, got injured, POD stopped their show for 10 minutes and openly prayed for the kid. All of these bands proclaim the name of Jesus, wherever they go. There is a long legacy of fruit and kids coming to the Lord. In addition, Toby Mac personally has explained the meaning of his album cover, on his Facebook page. This article is nothing but someone trying to hate on something great that God is doing, through music. Please, check your facts or actually interview the bands, before posting this nonsense. God Bless.

andy said...

what if just ONE person would change his life to follow christ because of the music he heard from such a band??
I mean, how else would you reach the death cores, the goth, the black metal heads, the e.g: finntroll listeners (lyrics about slaughtering christians and stuff)... if not by stepping into their lives somehow?? It may usually not be music to deeply worship to, i definitely agree, though it may be the only way to let them hear the WORD at all...

... said...

Hey. First of all, one's actions does not make someone something..for example..just because they have tatoos, doesnt mean that they're satanic or something like that..and they received their tatoos BEFORE they encountered's not the people that are in metal that young christians should be wary's people like you they need to be wary wanna know why these people stayed in the metal industries and hang out with those you call "Satanists"? it's because of people like you..we as christians are supposed to spread the message of love not judgement..
colossians 4:6 "Let your conversation be always full of grace, seasoned with salt, so that you may know how to answer everyone." dare you judge people when you yourself have not been judged? i'm not trying to judge you or anything..i know you wrote this with good intentions and stuff..just stop and think for a did you come to Christ? i'm pretty sure it's not because someone yelled at your face saying "HEY REPENT FOR YOU HAVE SINNED! I CHARGE THEE GUILTY OF...." what? no. NO. You came to Christ because of His amazing grace that came to you even though you did not deserve it..Why not stop saying that these people are satanists? look..even if these guys are not true Christians, they are spreading more love than you have in this blog post..and they are true Christians let me assure you of that..stop pushing these people away..stop segregating these people..they deserve as much love as you and i do..lastly, i would like to apologise for the tone of my comment because i'm really sick of people who segregates metal or people like that..speak God's grace my brother..stop looking too much into signs and start looking towards the Father..ask Him for the truth..not based on what you see..forgive me my brother..i hope you listen to me

Anonymous said...

Are you implying that baptism of the Holy Spirit is against the Bible?

Anonymous said...

Wow the hate talk here blows me away. Also the article is full of misinformation, and I see very little of Jesus reflected in the article or in the hateful comments. It would seam the author did little if no research on the what the actual Wosoevers movement is about. The Whosoevers is a great ministry, I have not seen so much focus on Jesus and his love hardly anywhere. The weekly Friday night study is a blessing on my spiritual life, as are the sessions from the "threat to formalized religion I am" event. If you want to keep bashing them, fine go ahead. But I challenge you all to seek Christ more, and to learn from the example of his life. Jesus's biggest enemies in his life were the Pharisees and Sadducees. He was hated by them because he loved and hung out with prostitutes and tax collectors.

Anonymous said...

Oh no, he must be in the illuminati! Losen up, be in the world but not of the world.

Anonymous said...

So what you're saying is that a person can't be saved from their past? You just said that all people who do drugs are deceivers and therefore cannot be saved. A relationship with God isn't for a select few.

Anonymous said...

Exactly!! Not one of us are perfect! Only one has ever been perfect, that's our Lord and Savior Jesus Christ!! How do you know what is truly in their hearts?!

mr liver said...

Pharisees eager to throw the stone? These people are real. They aren't trying to hide their past. It is a different kind of person. Not your typical stuck up, goody two-shoes with jewelry and their personal names printed inside their Bibles. I was raised in a very christian conservative home and was so sick of fake people in the church and people who cared more about saying the right answer then actually understanding.

I love God. I am tattooed, play rock n roll and regularly listen to secular music. And you know what? I can have a more real conversation talking to a secular individual about life and even the Bible then I do with most "christians" about anything. You're suit and matching shoes don't impress me and won't impress God when you show up at the pearly gates. They are taking action and making a real difference in real people's lives. Some of the heaviest bands in the Christian music scene have lyrics far more grounded in the Bible then a vast majority of your contemporary artists you accept in church on Sunday morning. If they are conveyed in a matter unacceptable to you-- who are you to tear the house apart for it? I'm sick of weak Christians not willing to make a difference. Who would rather pray and give money then leave their place of comfort. Grow up and quit your bickering. Thank God that your testimony doesn't involve you being beaten, abused, and dragged through the mud.

Anonymous said...

My suggestion to you would be to get to know the members of these bands personally before you judge their intentions. I know the guitarist for the Love and Death (JR Bereis) and i know his heart for the broken and lost people of the world. You are acting as a pharisee when you berate the practical actions of people who are constantly leading purple out of lifestyles of sin and addiction and into relationships with Jesus Christ. I will pray that God gives you a change of heart and leads you to help ministries that glorify him, rather than try to hurt. God bless everybody! Jesus is love! "God sent his son not to judge the world, but to save the world through him." -John 3:17

Anonymous said...

Are you perfect? Have you sinned? The truth always comes out........

Anonymous said...

All I can say about this article is WOW!!! who are we to judge others? The Whosoevers are reaching out to so many people, I have been to love and deaths concert and from what I seen those guys love God and are reaching out to young people. I went to a music festival and Love and death were suppose to play, but I don't think the sound equipment was right or something. Instead of playing a show they stuck around and Brian welch stayed and gave his testimony. So before we judge others we should take the time and focus on the plank that is in our eye, instead of wasting time writing a article why not talk with the whosoevers and get to know there heart and them.

Anonymous said...

So do you condemn people that still struggle with past addictions that go to church every weekend, but you see changes in them in different parts of their lives due to wanting to learn the truth? Also do you condemn people with "satanic" tattoos of their past before having a relationship with Christ?! There is a lot of doomed people out there then with false hopes! I seek the truth!

Anonymous said...

I agree. If they would read Head's book Save Me From Myself and his devotional they would see that Brain knows the real Jesus Christ. Not the false Jesus they think he follows. Kids aren't going to appreciate worship music and hymns (that I equally love as much as Christian rock) if they aren't saved. And have they really read the lyrics? P.O.D. and Head have blatant Christian lyrics! The very first song on P.O.D.'s new album mentions the "alchemy of Calvary." Sounds Christian to me!

Anonymous said...

I read most of the comments hear until I felt like puking. Most of you people sound like the same religious fanatics Jesus railed against for the few years He walked this rock. "Give me beautiful music", America used to be full of "God-Ferain'" people!!!

Give me a break! There has never been a "God-fearing" majority in this, or any other country. We have simply called on the name of God to fuel our bigotry and justify our wars. Have any of you ever talked to the people you are attacking in the name of God? Probably not.

Are you on the front lines of the war for our youth? I mean the FRONT lines... not the basement youth group.

Are you in a position where anyone at anytime can criticize you for your actions or do bodily harm to you for your beliefs.

Have you EVER come under fire from your friends because you believe a dead guy saved you for all eternity.

There may be some of you here who know what I'm talking about but I suspect not many since the people I describe have better things to do then shoot fellow Christians. Just keep singing your own tunes and when you finally meet these people in Heaven you can apologize then.

Anonymous said...

And just to clear up more of your misinformation ..... The whosoevers are not a band. They are a movement starting with a collection of musicians, artists, other ministries and individual people all over the world who choose Jesus and continue living real and transparent!
Not a band.

aaronjacobhocker369 said...

Look, I do not consider my self a Christian at all. I believe in a higher power, everyone has a name for it and a gender for it. I have grown up in church and heard just about every Bible story. But there is one thing that stood out to me and that is God will accept you for who you are. I have my thoughts On just about everything but I do not believe in hate. I hate no one nor those God. Yes I curse everyday I am no greater than anyone and no one is greater than me. Jesus preached to the wicked and went to where they were. He went to place where no holy man would and he himself got killed for it. They believed he was wicked. They believed he was a deciver just because he was doing something new. He was always around sinners. So just because The Whosoevers are doing something new and probably what Jesus would have also done to reach out to the lost and wicked , you are no better than the holy men that crucified Jesus.

Yes I listen to all sorts of music even Christian music. There are tons of music out there but not one better than the other. Yes I am a fan of Brian Head Welch, woo. Oh well. I believe I am not going to hell nor is Brian Welch. I have met him before he is a very nice guy. I read his book Save Me From Myself. He did not quit cause he found God but he quit so his little girl wouldn't be around drugs, alcohol, and cursing and public nudity. Yes he found God. He has his own personal relationship with God. I have my own personal relationship with, what other people call God. I have a goal to study all religions and see what they have to say. It is going to take me a long time to do that but I will find who "God" really is. I will do right by me and others. Every one knows right from wrong so why do we have to listen to a God that tells us it like we can't think for ourselves. We have free will so why waste it away by not finding ourselves by not finding our true God.

Tear me a new one if you will. Try to proove me wrong but I am who I am. I am not going to change because a God you created "told" me so. We got to love each other. The true God is out there and no one is searching but I will.

I am Aaron Jacob Hocker.

Dan White said...

Hey! I think they're doing great!

Let us remember how Jesus got His point across in John 6:

" “I tell you the truth, unless you eat the flesh of the Son of Man and drink his blood, you have no life in you. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood has eternal life, and I will raise him up at the last day. For my flesh is real food and my blood is real drink. Whoever eats my flesh and drinks my blood remains in me, and I in him. Just as the living Father sent me and I live because of the Father, so the one who feeds on me will live because of me. This is the bread that came down from heaven. Your forefathers ate manna and died, but he who feeds on this bread will live forever.” He said this while teaching in the synagogue in Capernaum."

Again in Luke 11:

"Then the Lord said to him, “Now then, you Pharisees clean the outside of the cup and dish, but inside you are full of greed and wickedness. You foolish people! Did not the one who made the outside make the inside also? But give what is inside [the dish]j to the poor, and everything will be clean for you.

“Woe to you Pharisees, because you give God a tenth of your mint, rue and all other kinds of garden herbs, but you neglect justice and the love of God. You should have practiced the latter without leaving the former undone.

“Woe to you Pharisees, because you love the most important seats in the synagogues and greetings in the marketplaces.

“Woe to you, because you are like unmarked graves, which men walk over without knowing it.”

One of the experts in the law answered him, “Teacher, when you say these things, you insult us also.”

Jesus replied, “And you experts in the law, woe to you, because you load people down with burdens they can hardly carry, and you yourselves will not lift one finger to help them.

“Woe to you, because you build tombs for the prophets, and it was your forefathers who killed them. So you testify that you approve of what your forefathers did; they killed the prophets, and you build their tombs. Because of this, God in his wisdom said, ‘I will send them prophets and apostles, some of whom they will kill and others they will persecute.’ Therefore this generation will be held responsible for the blood of all the prophets that has been shed since the beginning of the world, from the blood of Abel to the blood of Zechariah, who was killed between the altar and the sanctuary. Yes, I tell you, this generation will be held responsible for it all.

“Woe to you experts in the law, because you have taken away the key to knowledge. You yourselves have not entered, and you have hindered those who were entering.” "

So should we be offensive as Christians?

Have you forgotten how dastardly outrageous it is to carry the cross on your neck and slap it on top of your politically correct churches?
Have you forgotten it was a method of capital punishment? The most gruesome, bloodiest form, at that?

I, as well, have a problem with certain symbols. I don't agree with the use of the Free Mason Eye, or the Nazi styling, etc. but we're throwin' the baby out with the bathwater here.

I want to also remind you that your beloved hymns were adapted from Irish drinking songs.

One thing I do see and that Satan cannot stand is love. The people love God and the broken ones God is wooing.

Anonymous said...

The symbols are used to address false religion guys,not support it.The masonic,witchcraft,satanic symbols shown on their posters and whatnot are not to glorify these things but to expose them and show the lost the path to Jesus Christ and to leave false religions..Maybe a little more investigation and less trigger finger would be beneficial to the body as a whole.I came out of the occult and very aware of these symbols and its good to see the Whosoever group exposing these things that are usually used in secret and embedded in television ETC..Praise the Lord for brave soldiers of God to tread where most believers fear to tread..

Areta E said...

Hi Bible Believer and dear readers,

I am happy to see your faith in Jesus and love for His Word. I can see your concern and worry for young Christians and I'm glad that you care and made an effort to address your concerns. However, there are a few things that I'd like to point out.

Firstly, I think all musics are from God. He gives us creativity and we create music from the creativity that He gives us. Whether or not a music is "Christian" is based on the content or the words, not the genre or instruments.

Secondly, these bands that you wrote about, they are working a secular job, just like most of us, but they've shown themselves to be different by not using swear words, letting their faith to influence their work and outspokenly admit their faith in Jesus when possible. The difference is, their work involves being public figures. As fellow Christians, aren't we supposed to be praying for them and supporting them, not bad-mouthing them?

Thirdly, if our brothers sin, aren't we supposed to rebuke gently and lovingly, in private first, giving them a chance to repent, not shaming them publicly? Afterall, our goal is their repentance and our motivation is love.

Fourthly, unity in the body of Christ is very important. If we're speaking badly of our brothers this way, it looks very ridiculous from outside. Non-believers will see that we as Christians can't even keep peace amongst ourselves. I'm not saying that we have to agree in every single thing, but our manner in disagreeing must reflect the one thing that we all agree on: Jesus Christ.

Lastly, the sign of being Christians is that people CAN SEE we're loving one another. So, in expressing our concerns for our brothers, have we made God's love and our love for each other visible to outsiders?

May the peace of God in Jesus Christ be with you all,


Anonymous said...

This is just typical Rock-hating paranoia. You guys remind me of the conspiracy theorists that are totally convinced we never landed on the moon and that the world is secretly enslaved by an evil secret society. The people that see satanic or cult symbols in every single thing they look at...

Firstly, no, there is not any "pentagram" t-shirts to be seen. I simply see a star with a face in it, not a pentagram (what's next, are we gonna call the Israeli flag satanic because it has a star on it?). And secondly, using an artistic picture of an EYEBALL (yeah, I don't see how they are turning anybody into satan-worshiping wackos with eyeball imagery) is not satanic. It's just ART. The same goes for OWLS. It's commonly used art.
Let's say those symbols ARE satanic. Would they really be displaying them for people to see, and work out the meaning? Evil works through deception, not out-rightness. They don't need art symbols to deceive people.

This comes down to the belief that Rock and Metal music is satanic. That's like saying church congregations are satanic because there is a church of satan. Yep, there is some bands that are satanic, and yes most of them are either Rock or Metal bands, but you can't lump every band from a type of music into one group. Bands like these are sometimes the only light in the darkness, in places where the people there are never going to go to church or talk with pastors or witnessing Christians.
The band Switchfoot will never be listened to by people in dark bars or clubs who are aggressively anti-Christian. But if there is a band of Christian guys that play music that sounds just like the angry or hateful music people like, except that it is actually preaching about GOD and His love, don't you think that is a good thing? Bands that are Christian play music that appeals to people fighting God, and witness to those same people without them even realizing it.

Here are lyrics to a song called "I AM" by the band Becoming the Archetype. Read the lyrics first and then go listen to the song and see what you think. THEN tell people how satanic this kind of music is.


In ages past
I spoke to man
Like man would speak to ME
I rode upon the four high winds


My power was shown
In works of might
That My children might be-lieve
The blinding weight of glory
No human eye could see


I move among your HEARTS
I swim inside your VEINS
I stay behind the scenes and speak
My life infused with many sons
My truth inside your soul
My body is comprised of the nations
Who will make my Kingdom whole


“I move among your hearts.”
“I swim inside your veins.”
“I stay behind the scenes and speak.”
“To hearts who would obey.”
“My life infused with many song.”
“My truth inside your soul.”
“My body is comprised of the nations.”
“Who will make My Kingdom whole.”
“Now I among your hearts.”
“And swim inside your veins”
“I stay behind the scenes and speak.”
“To hearts who would obey.”


andysheridan said...

Hey dude, check it out....

you made the headlines on Brians page. For all your questions/comments (which by the way are ridiculous), check out the comments and replies to his post.

and I'm not anonymous

heres my email

have a great day

Anonymous said...

Didn't you know that the Lion in his Chronicles of Narnia series represented satan?!?!?!?!

Anonymous said...

Wow isn't it great that all you "so call" christian are bashing the whosoevers? God looks at the heart not your appearance. I am a Christian. Oh by the way why are they called whosoevers? "...who so ever beleive in me shall not perish but have eternal life" John 3:16. Oh yea and what where Jesus's followers. Thieves, murderers, liars, and sinners. Why? because they needed him the most. If God looked at appearance, then none of us would be saved and this world would be condemned. "God did not send his son to condemn the world but through he we might be saved" John 3:15. The whosoevers exist because we hate organized religion. In fact read the bible, it's what killed Jesus in the first place. These jews followed the law of moses, and therefore thought of Jesus as a blasphemer. On top of that religion has saved nobody. Jesus saves. And that is the heart of the whosoevers. So everyone that is bashing us, check your hearts and your walks with God, because if you are letting these little things that have no meaning get to you, then you are obviously not walking with God. I am a worship band leader of my Youth group, I spend my time with God, and I also love heavy metal. Because there is nothing wrong in it, especially when you are using it to worship God. Well i have said all that i needed to say. I shall pray for all of you, because on top of that I am also a prayer warrior. And if its one thing that I love about the whosoevers is that they help save lives for Jesus, and that's what this is all about.

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